London Heads of Human Resources
Notes of the Workshop held on Friday 23 November 2012
In attendance
Marj Keddy (Chair)
Marcelle Moncrieffe-Johnson
Nick Hollier
Tammy Eglinton
Zoe Hoskin
David Veale
Joanne Meagher
Caroline Anderson
Elaine Harris
Steve Davis
Redbridge
Brent
Bexley
Bromley
Camden
Ealing
Greenwich
Hackney
Hammersmith & Fulham
Haringey
Jon Turner
Caroline Nugent
Pauline Moore
Craig Woods
Jackie Stirling
Beverley Williams
Althea Loderick
Stephanie Bell
Selena Lansley
Debbie Williams
Suzanne Hudson
Action
1.
Apologies
Apologies were received from Martin Rayson (B&D), Sarah
Murphy-Brookman (Barnet), Charles Obazuaye (Bromley), Sharon
Brown (Hackney), Debbie Morris (H&F), Anne Scott (Hounslow),
Debra Norman (Islington), Andreas Ghosh (Lewisham), Dean
Shoesmith (Merton/Sutton), Bernard Nawrat (Southwark), Carolyn
Beech (Westminster) and Libby Grant (City of London).
2.
Notes of last meeting
The notes of the workshop held on 12 October 2012
3.
Matters arising
There were no matters arising from the minutes
4.
Presentation: Update on Public Health Pensions - Jeff Houston, LGA
Jeff updated colleagues on the following:

Two choices of pension schemes
- LGPS – bring in NHS employees from day one
- NHS – leave employees in this scheme
The NHS scheme is not broadly comparable with the LGPS
scheme so the scheme would have to change for these
Harrow
Havering
Hillingdon
Lambeth
Lewisham
Newham
Waltham Forest
Westminster
London Councils
London Councils
LGA
Progress


employees.
There have been discussions about what happens from Day
Two onwards – what happens to these employees?
- local authorities naturally want to formulise asap;
- great feeling from NHS that there is a cultural aspect to
remaining in the NHS scheme;
- Those in the NHS 1995 scheme have protections – which
are very good, so those in the 1995 scheme will stay with
this scheme.
Employees have been split into seven categories:
- any new employees coming in to health will automatically
go into the LGPS scheme;
- Public health functions from local authorities will stay in the
LGPS scheme, e.g. LA to PH job;
- People who come in on day one on the NHS scheme but
want to voluntarily move outside of the public health function
will go in to the LGPS scheme (i.e do not want to work in
public health anymore);
- Employees who move over on day one and then are
restructured with the local authority stay on the NHS
scheme;
Recommendations made to group leaders are:
 Covered by transfer scheme – people who move in to the
public health function and apply for another job within this
function (1) if you are going to harmonise a voluntary move
is good to go for, or (2) want to recruit but have people stuck
in a post as they do not want to lose the NHS pension (e.g.
1995 staff), financially would cost the LGPS as they are long
service employees. Option one – as part of the transfer they
would be protected they would be protected in the scheme in
the local authority they currently work in. Option two – staff
who are in the NHS scheme – the definition of a public
health worker has been looked at and the trade unions’
definition, which will be put to group leaders, is:
“someone who does a public health job and is registered
with a nationally recognised organisation”.
If this is accepted we would look to put in the transfer
scheme for this staff.

The final group of staff are the ones who move to a public
health from another local authority or work currently work in
the NHS and apply for a public health authority job. Same
arguments apply to the pre 1995 staff. The LGA have
spoken to the Department of Health and those who want to
transfer then the authority can apply for a pre-directions
order – authorities do not have to do this but it is an option.
These recommendations have gone to the political groups for a
seven day response. Decision will be sent to authorities within
the next three weeks.
The LGA are currently working with NHS pensions to produce a
guide on being a new NHS employer.
If anyone would like further details please contact Jeff Houston.
5.
Presentation: Update on Public Health – Richard Edge, NHS London
Richard updated colleagues on the latest developments regarding
the public health HR transition.
A copy of Richard’s presentation is attached.
Microsoft PowerPoint
97-2003 Presentation
If anyone has any questions for Richard please contact him at
Richard Edge or 0207 932 3700 ext 4179
6.
Proposed London Boroughs Redeployment Protocol - Caroline Anderson & Jon Turner
David Marshall, Jobs Go Public, presented a systems overview of
the London Councils Jobs Portal.
The system is:

Process initiated – following an interview with the employee
at risk a member of the HR department would register the
individual’s details on the site would send an invitation to the
individual to join the jobs portal.
The individual would then enter their details which would
create an email to send them any vacancy alerts.

Adding vacancies – the HR department would upload any
vacancies on to the system.
All vacancies would carry the authorities’ logo.
Vacancies would be published to any job seeker for a
window of time (this to be chosen by the authority).
Heads of HR to
confirm by email to
Debbie by 30
November if they
will/will not be
signing up to the
portal

Reporting – the system has a ‘one click’ reporting capability
which will give a global report on any redeployment activities.
A copy of David’s presentation and the outline contract are
attached.
Microsoft PowerPoint Microsoft Word 97 97-2003 Presentation 2003 Document
7.
E-Paycheck – Steve Davies
Seventeen London boroughs have indicated they want to sign up.
These authorities will have some contractual sign-ups to use the
system. London Councils will sign the over-arching agreement.
Haringey are going to be the regional administrators and will be
organising training on the system.
If anyone would like further details contact Steve Davies
8.
Haringey HR Metrics – Steve Davies
HR metrics survey results will be circulated to colleagues by the
end of November.
This year’s contract is nearing renewal – Steve Davies will be
contacting boroughs soon to sign up for 2013.
London Councils/IES are currently undertaking an audit of the
service. Colleagues were emailed for colleagues at the beginning
of November for comments.
9.
Project Athena
Colleagues will be in a position to give an update in January 2013
on the different strands of the project.
10.
Terms & Conditions
Results of the recent update on terms and conditions have been
emailed to colleagues.
Updates from colleagues in attendance:
Ealing – S118 notice issued. Trade unions now want to talk.
Going for £1m savings – incl freeze, pay protection, Ealing
supplement, revising organisational policy.
Bromley – Members have agreed to come out National terms and
conditions as of w/b 19 November. Expect to be going through 90
day consultation soon.
Camden – Failed to reach collective agreement with trade unions.
Going out to staff for voluntary sign up to new T&C’s in April 2013.
Offering staff £1,000 sign up incentive.
Brent – Similar process to Camden. Changed T&C’s for working
hours. Staff issued a new contract and will be implementing in
January 2013.
Hammersmith & Fulham – ALMO staff bought back in house and
trying to align there T&C’s with H&F – ALMOs currently offer more
general T&Cs.
10.
London Councils Update
A copy of the London Councils update for November is attached
for information.
Microsoft Word 97 2003 Document
11.
Any Other Business
Suzanne Hudson, LGA
HSCP are reporting a 74.4% renewal rate of social worker
registration. Social workers are holding out on registering as they
think they will not have to pay the full fees – realistically they will
end up paying twice.
Agency Social Workers Framework has been agreed which will
inform us of the main agencies boroughs can use. Link http://www.local.gov.uk/web/guest/workforce//journal_content/56/10171/3511605/ARTICLE-TEMPLATE
OFSTED are going to start inspecting employers to make sure
they have looked at the Employer Standards and have done
something with the recommendations.
Selena Lansley – Mapping Survey
Selena circulated the attached mapping survey and asked
colleagues if they would find it useful for London Councils to
reword and come up with a steer on what colleagues would like to
share and how we share it for the future.
Adobe Acrobat
Document
12.
Date of Next Meeting
Friday 18 January 2013, 10am-1pm, at London Councils offices.
Steve Davies,
Haringey, agreed to
come up with a
mapping survey