-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------From: Carol Rivin <[email protected]>
Date: Tuesday, March 8, 2016 at 1:27 PM
Hi Andy,
No, I don’t think I need to see any more. The CS track is distinctive in that 3/4 courses are lower division, whereas the others
are all upper division. That probably should go into individual program planning so that students take those courses at
appropriate times.
CR
From: Carol Rivin <[email protected]>
Date: Tuesday, March 8, 2016 at 9:26 AM
To: "Hendrix, David" <[email protected]>
Cc: Andrew Karplus <[email protected]>, Indira Rajagopal <[email protected]>, Phil
McFadden <[email protected]>, Kari van Zee <[email protected]>, "Nyarko, Afua"
<[email protected]>, "Ahern, Kevin" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: BMB Cat 1 proposal
Hi, David. Thanks for sending me “tracks” for the computational option.
Carol Rivin
On Mar 7, 2016, at 3:51 PM, Hendrix, David <[email protected]> wrote:
Here is the proposed update to the Computational Molecular Biology Option.
Dave
> On 3/7/16, 3:16 PM, "Carol Rivin" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Hi Andy,
>>
>> Sorry I couldn’t get back to you till now. Thanks for adding in the courses I suggested. I still think there are issues with the
computational track — because it is still several different tracks folded together, and the CS track includes a lot of lower division
units. I think for this to be reasonable, it would require swapping some general lower division requirements for the CS ones (physics
for example, though that would be unpopular for lots of reasons). I would like to see some sample programs of study in this option
to get a better sense of how students would be guided to some good mix of courses. I’m still dubious— but maybe Hendrix has it
figured out? It sounds more like a minor in CS— which could be more valuable than an option…
>>
>> Carol
>>
On Mar 7, 2016, at 10:03 AM, Karplus, Andy <[email protected]> wrote:
HI Carol,
Thanks for your comments. You raised many good points, and our BB curriculum group met and made some changes to the
programs in light of your comments. I just called to chat briefly about this, and left a message saying I’d send this email and be glad
to chat if you’d like. Here, to let you know how we’re responding to your suggestions, I’ve inserted comments below in your email
and attached a short word document that is just the curricular pages of the proposal with yellow highlighting for new courses added
and a comment for courses removed.
Thanks again for your feedback and help shaping this. Andy
>>>> 1. Jeff Anderson just had a course approved that should be on your course list. It is BOT 460 Functional Genomics. The
emphasis will be on protein prediction and proteomics, so it will be a good partner to the genomic/transcriptomic classes.
We’re glad to have this course available now and have added it to both the Computational Mol Biol and the Advanced Mol Biol
options. We also added the new Micro “Human Microbiome” and "MB420 Microbial Genomes" courses to the computational
option.
>>>> 2. The pre-medicine option should include BI 311 Genetics, rather than only Microbial Genetics
We’ve added Genetics to both the Premed and the Computational options, so it is now a part of all three options.
>>>> 3. Computational option seems poorly thought out— just a long list of courses without any sense of what a good program
would be...
>>>> a. includes a listing of courses that aren’t possible within the 14 credit electives. This is particularly true along the CS
path. To take a 400 level course like CS420 or CS446 (both on your elective list) requires that students take Math 231, CS 161, 162,
261 and 325—> 20 units of pre-requisites! Taking this route adds substantially more units, and it has no space for genomics or stats.
>>>>
>>>> Stats seems to be a different track in which one can do a route that is more mathematical and one that is less so. The
mathematical track requires Math 253, which doesn’t qualify as an elective, but probably should if a student does the ST 421, 422,
441 route.
>>>>
>>>> b. unclear what might be considered an optimal mix of courses. To get to a 300 level course in CS requires 16 units of lower
division CS and math. That is an awful lot of lower division courses in an option. Is it realistic? Is it best if students have some mix of
CS and Stats? What would a program look like? How would students be advised?
The group decided that Stats 421, 422 and 441 are more advanced than are justifiable for this option and were removed. They left
all the CS classes in with the suggestion that there could be three fairly distinct paths through the option that are either Stats / CS /
Biology focused, as well as many paths that involve greater mixes of these courses. David Hendrix showed the group how if one
focuses on CS there are paths that include the various listed courses. David said he had a diagram that he could send if you’d like to
see it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------On 2/26/16, 11:44 AM, "Carol Rivin" <[email protected]> wrote:
>Andy,
>
>I looked over the CAT1 proposal to offer a Biochemistry/Molecular Biology degree. In general, I think it is a fine idea,
and that the options in Advanced Mol Biol and in Pre-Medicine look pretty good. I think the Computational option is a
bit of a mess, though.
>
>So, a few specifics:
>
>1. Jeff Anderson just had a course approved that should be on your course list. It is BOT 460 Functional Genomics.
The emphasis will be on protein prediction and proteomics, so it will be a good partner to the genomic/transcriptomic
classes.
>
>2. The pre-medicine option should include BI 311 Genetics, rather than only Microbial Genetics
>
>3. Computational option seems poorly thought out— just a long list of courses without any sense of what a good
program would be...
>
>a. includes a listing of courses that aren’t possible within the 14 credit electives. This is particularly true along the CS
path. To take a 400 level course like CS420 or CS446 (both on your elective list) requires that students take Math 231, CS
161, 162, 261 and 325—> 20 units of pre-requisites! Taking this route adds substantially more units, and it has no space
for genomics or stats.
>
>Stats seems to be a different track in which one can do a route that is more mathematical and one that is less so. The
mathematical track requires Math 253, which doesn’t qualify as an elective, but probably should if a student does the ST
421, 422, 441 route.
>
>b. unclear what might be considered an optimal mix of courses. To get to a 300 level course in CS requires 16 units of
lower division CS and math. That is an awful lot of lower division courses in an option. Is it realistic? Is it best if
students have some mix of CS and Stats? What would a program look like? How would students be advised?
>
>OK. There’s my two cents.
>
>Call me if this is clear as mud.
>
>Carol Rivin