Rogue River Outfitter Meeting
November 13, 2014, 2:00 – 3:30 p.m.
Grants Pass Interagency Office
2164 NE Spalding Avenue, Grants Pass, Oregon
Agency Briefing
Audits
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Statewide Audits: a cross section of 11 SUP’s throughout the resource area will be audited.
Commercial Outfitters on the Rogue River that are selected will receive a certified letter in late
winter/early spring
Barb will send out a letter to the Outfitters if any changes are made for the 2015 season
Monitoring
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Folks have continued to be placed at Grave Creek pre and post season (two weekends before
and two weekends after), counting users that enter into the Wild section
Most days have been under/well under the 120 capacity. Two days in 2014 were over, one in
May and one in October, both Friday’s.
Maybe some additional compliance floats could be conducted before and after the regulated
use season.
Permit Violations and Outfitter Expectations
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Consistency and violations
In the incident of an outfitter and private group getting in a confrontation – Allen says to expect
the outfitter to be “professional” and go above and beyond. To “set the tone” on the river
An outfitter stated he appreciates getting calls about employee “wrong doing”/incidents.
Another outfitter said he doesn’t think we hear at the BLM the positives and how the outfitters
give assistance to the public – always hearing the negative instead
Anticipated Changes
Shuttle Permitting
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There will be a permitting process for Shuttle Companies beginning in the 2015 season with
the FS
FS will be contacting shuttle providers in the upcoming months
Permits will first be issued as a 2 year priority permit and then can extend to 8 years if on good
behavior
Enforcement will take place at Foster bar and the bottom of Bear Camp road on the FS side
Fees could go towards enhancing rec areas like Foster Bar
If an outfitter also does shuttling – the FS will look at possibility to just add that to their current
permit
Insurance requirements are a big component of shuttle permits
Will there be a limit to the number of permits given out for shuttle companies? – the FS doesn’t
see limiting capacity
Identifying Critical Services
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The FS has the opportunity to remold their River program with Tom retiring
What do you value the most?
What do you want to see done differently, if any?
Group Discussion
Feedback on the 2014 season
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CONs
o More education on boat carnage to the private sector
o Educating users about waiting for Drift Boats to be cleared of “channels” (blossom,
rainie, mule creek)
o Fishing etiquette with lines
o Toilet Paper gardens still in the canyon
o Respect on the boat ramp – both outfitter and private (especially afternoons around 3
pm at Grave Creek)
o BLM compliance crew – PFD unzippered
o Dusty road during Bear Camp re-route
o Add a few more signs/arrows for the Bear Camp re-route
PROs
o No wildfires
o Rand education and communication
o Culvert replacement done early
o Lots of open lines for communication during fire events (even if it didn’t relate to the
river)
Boat Carnage
o Handouts at Rand?
o Outfitter could report it to Rand ASAP when seen
o Could an outfitter go to Paradise and call Rand?
RRR
o Museum will be closed in 2015
o Tabernacle and Black Smith shop are open and finished
Foster Bar caretaker
o FS may need a new caretaker after May
Campsite Competition
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The BLM and the FS want to provide a High Quality recreational experience on the river. The
group was asked for input on: “What do you see the problem is…..?”
o Small groups taking large sites and not willing to share - It’s “Public Land”
o Large groups vs small groups, not commercial vs noncommercial
o Has to do with size of groups
o Finite # of parties – reduce #’s per day (6-8 is common on other rivers)
o Layover days – is this an issue? Eliminate?
o Map and campsite handout at Rand may not go to the person that is actually looking for
the camp spots on the river
Other thoughts….
o Tell small groups to stay at small sites
o Look at the Main Salmon – have a specified # of people for sites, a reservation system,
and a 5:00 “rule”
o Penalty for small parties staying at large sites
o Designate certain sites as “Multi-party” sites
o Signage like on the Deschutes – carsinites put up at sites stating name and large/small
 New technology with “apps” and maps may help with camp names and locations
– these links could be posted on the website
o Elaborate dry erase board at Rand – extend to 10 days, have more of rolling calendar –
add list of camps and include small camps – ask both small and large groups to
participate
o Ask large groups to pass on permit # of small groups that stay at large camp sites
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o What about being “locked” in and regulated more with new regulations and restrictions?
(Designating Large Group Only campsites….less launches per day…limiting
layovers…..etc.)
o Allen – “Less is better in the long run…”
Potential management actions
o Allen identified several potential management actions.
o The BLM/FS will go through the Initial Scoping this winter/spring and put it out for public
comment
o BLM/FS will work together and will have to work with whoever’s process is the most
limiting/restricting (NEPA/EIS/ES, etc)
A few more comments…..
o Eliminating “splitting” groups?
 1:30 rule on the Salmon
 Allow splitting on the river – but not to grab a camp early
 Momentum is NOT for eliminating splitting
 Likes to have the option to set up camp prior to the guests arriving to camp –
makes it more comfortable to those visitors that may be unfamiliar/scared of
wild camping
 Reason to not stop splitting– work load for guides setting up camp is higher –
privates have the whole group that can work together
o Put a panel together of Party Leaders from large groups in the last 5 years or so to add
input on their experience with campsite competition
o What is the timeframe of seeing results from the list Allen mentioned as potential
management actions?
 A few months for BLM/FS to clearly represent the options
 30-90 days for public comments
 What will the product be and what will we have to go through (NEPA? EIS?)
 Then – see some times frames
 MAYBE an attempt for the 2015 season
o Signs without regulation stated and compliance may increase conflicts
o Owyhee limits layovers
Future Meetings
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Continue having meetings – they are valuable