Apr 17 08 GC Meeting: 400-level Credit on Programs of Study
BACKGROUND:
Excerpt from email message dated 11/26/03 from Bruce Rettig, Associate Dean of the Graduate
School, to Graduate Council:
…In 2001, the Graduate Level Learning Task Force recommended eliminating slash
courses and allowing 6 to 12 credits of 4XX courses on a graduate program of study.
On January 24, 2002, the Council adopted that recommendation, subject to a later
decision about the number of permitted 4XX courses. On February 14, 2002, the
Council agreed that the number of allowable non-blanket 4XX credits would be 18.
When the Council determined that opposition to their action would not allow elimination
of slash courses, the 18 credit allowance of 4XX courses was rescinded. However,
Graduate Council minutes from 2001-2002 and 2002-2003 include comments from
some Council members who supported the inclusion of some amount of 4XX courses,
even with the retention of the slash course system. The minutes also show that other
Council members did not see the purpose of allowing undergraduate credits on a
program of study, assuming that the slash course system stays in place.
Task Force on Graduate Level Learning
(from 12-11-2003 GC Minutes)
• Graduate Level Learning
A Task Force on Graduate Level Learning, which was charged with investigating concerns of
graduate students regarding courses that are offered as 4xx/5xx submitted its final report on June
12, 2001. The Task Force recommended that the slash course system be eliminated, but that 6 to
12 credits of 4XX-level courses be permitted on a graduate program of study. On January 24,
2002, the Graduate Council decided to adopt the recommendation of the Task Force, but delayed
a decision on the total number of 4XX-level credits to be allowed on the graduate program of
study. On February 14, 2002, the Council set the maximum number of 4XX-level credits on a
program of study at 18. Because the proposal to eliminate the slash course system was not
subsequently approved by the Curriculum Council and because the Graduate Council considered
the two policies to be coupled, the action to allow 4XX-level credits on programs of study was
rescinded by the Council.
During the 2002-2003 academic year, the Graduate Council continued to work on the problem of
graduate level learning. On November 14, 2002, the Council adopted a policy requiring that 50%
of all credits in any graduate program of study be graduate standalone credits. The matter of
permitting undergraduate credits on graduate programs, which had been set aside after the Task
Force's recommendation had been abandoned, continued to be a matter of interest to some of the
Council members. Barbara Bond (Forestry) asked the Council to take up the issue of 4XX-level
credits again. She argued that the 50% rule would be more acceptable to the campus community
if some 4XX-level credits could be used on a graduate program of study. The current policy,
slated for implementation in 2005, is that 50% of the credits on a program of study must be
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stand-alone courses with the remainder of the credits consisting of either the 5XX component of
a slash course offered separately or graduate standalone credits. The question before the Council
is whether any undergraduate credits should be allowed as part of the remaining 50% of credits
that are not graduate standalone; if so, how many credits?
Bruce Rettig (Graduate School) said that it would be helpful to know, assuming some 4XX
credits are allowed on a program of study, whether 4XX courses could be accepted in transfer.
He indicated that the policy on this varies widely among our peers, with some institutions
allowing only 4XX credits from their institution and none in transfer and others that accept 4XX
credits in transfer if the credits are allowed for graduate study at the institution where the credits
were earned.
Brent Steel (Liberal Arts) said that the 50% rule has major implications for both graduate and
undergraduate programs. Consequently, he argued that a survey is needed. Sally Francis
(Graduate School) reminded the Council that the Task Force that she appointed did conduct a
campus-wide survey of the both faculty and students. In response to a recommendation from a
public forum held toward the end of the 2002-2003 academic year, the Graduate School also
conducted a survey of departments.
John Selker (Agricultural Sciences) said that graduate students in interdisciplinary programs,
such as those associated with the IGERT (Integrative Graduate Education and Research
Traineeship) grants funded by the National Science Foundation, need to take some
undergraduate courses to broaden their knowledge in areas supporting their previous education.
Francis commented on the argument that allowing 4XX courses would dilute the quality of
graduate education. This issue was raised two years ago. The counter-argument then was that
major professors and other members of advisory committees will continue to have authority to
decide what courses they will approve on a program of study.
Ciuffetti said that she had talked with Bond, who had to miss this meeting, about this issue. Bond
is in favor of allowing some 4XX level courses because the 50% rule ensures that students will
have a basic amount of standalone courses. Not all courses need to be of that nature. Bond
believes in "truth in advertising." If the course is 4XX level, most students will be
undergraduates, but graduate students will understand this when they register. Students are more
frustrated when the 5XX component of a slash course promises a graduate experience but find
themselves in courses made up mostly of undergraduate students.
Ciuffetti said that she was willing to be convinced that her concerns over diluting the quality of a
graduate experience were overstated, but that she continues to be concerned about the number of
4XX courses that a student would take. Elaine Pedersen (Health and Human Sciences) said that a
properly taught the 5XX component of a slash course is often taught in a classroom at the
4XX/5XX level, but that additional material is provided for the graduate stduents.
Francis reminded the Council that the Task Force was appointed in part because of
inconsistencies in the amount of additional work required for slash course graduate credit,
according to student comments made during program reviews.
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Ciuffetti suggested that many slash courses would remain slash courses because of the numbers
needed to continue the course. In some specialities, there may not be too few undergraduates and
too few graduate students to support separate courses, but the courses can be viable when both
groups of students are included in the same class. She asked how many courses would remain if
slash courses were offered solely as 4XX courses. Steel said that in his program, a course is
offered as a 4XX standalone course one term and a 5XX standalone course the next term.
Selker said that he would like more research on faculty views on these issues. An online survey
can be set up easily. Faculty could be asked to consider different options, such as the number of
4XX classes to be allowed and the number of credits to be allowed. Surveys have been used in
the past with good success. He added that the survey should involve only members of the OSU
graduate faculty.
Francis noted that the Graduate Council represents all the academic colleges on campus. Council
members could poll their constituents before a future meeting so that they could reflect the views
of their academic units when the cast their votes. They could also choose to survey faculty in
their academic college.
Hal Koenig (Business) argued that there are two places our graduate students go after graduation;
some OSU graduate programs feed other degree programs (students graduating with masters
degrees going to other schools for other graduate degrees), and other graduates take jobs in the
public or private sectors. In either situation, there will be expectations of what an MS in
mechanical engineering or an MBA is capable of, and what experiences they had as part of their
degree program. Koenig believes that Oregon State University does itself a disservice if faculty
allow the graduate experience to be watered down and that this lack of rigor will ultimately haunt
OSU; students may not be able to get into top tier graduate programs at other schools or they
may not be hired by organizations and businesses. When OSU's reputation for a particular
graduate program suffers, some percent of the time halo-effects will show up. That is, when a
company has a bad experience with an OSU graduate from a weak graduate program, they may
assume that all OSU graduate programs are weak and, in future hiring decisions, graduates from
solid OSU graduate programs are not hired by that company.
Tony Collins(Pharmacy) asked whether the Graduate School should be lenient and allow the
colleges to utilize 4XX courses if they so choose? Koenig argued against variable standards from
college to college. As a minor professor, he does not want to be required to carry out a battle
when he is reluctant to approve courses on a program of study from departments that choose to
allow 4XX courses.
Steel suggested that flexibility in the use of slash courses is valuable when developing a new
program and when numbers initially are small. The bar can be raised, with requirements for only
5XX standalone and 6XX level courses when the number of graduate students in the program
increases.
Koenig said the current policy includes a 50% rule. Under this circumstance, he would not be
opposed to allowing some 4XX-level courses because this allows students to know what type of
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experience they will get from their courses. Although he could see a small fraction of the
program of study including 4XX courses, he does want to preserve quality.
Ciuffetti asked the group how they felt about gathering more information. What information is
needed and how should it be collected? Should each Council member consult with their
individual colleges? If so, a consensus is needed. How can the same questions be posed to all
faculty? Should a survey be conducted? Ciuffetti prefers the approach of each Council member
consulting their individual college.
Dale Pehrsson (Education) expressed concern that the word on campus is that faculty voices are
not being heard. Ciuffetti recalled attendance at the forums conducted last spring, which were
very poorly attended. Her preference would be to send an email statement to the people in her
college. The statement would invite comments and set a certain amount of time for the response
to be submitted. Selker suggested that the disgruntled may be hesitant to speak up in a group and
supported the creation of a structured set of questions to be used in an open survey.
Ciuffetti said that she needs to send a letter as part of the response to the follow-up visit from the
Accreditation agency. This letter will note that slash courses are still being discussed. Further
discussion of this issue was postponed until a future meeting.
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