TRANSCRIPT
Television Interview: Virginia Trioli, Michael Rowland, Alex Malley
ABC News 24 Breakfast
Tuesday 21st July 2015
Subjects: GST, Bronwyn Bishop, STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Maths), Neil
Armstrong,
VIRGINIA TRIOLI: We are delighted to be joined by Alex Malley, CEO of CPA Australia. Alex, good
morning.
ALEX MALLEY: Good morning. Be still my beating heart, I missed you two.
TRIOLI: Oh did you? Oh that’s nice, thank you.
MICHAEL ROWLAND: Thanks Alex.
MALLEY: And this stand-up comedy stuff – sitting down – it’s brilliant.
TRIOLI: Is it working?
ROWLAND: We’re going national next month.
ALL: [Laughs]
TRIOLI: Getting our own show… Who’s going to watch it? What’s first on your list today?
MALLEY: First on the list is the GST issue – you’d expect me to cover – but from a different perspective.
TRIOLI: So did you send your speaking notes up to Mike Baird, did you?
MALLEY: Well, your news last night said he is armed with our research. Quote, unquote. But look, here’s
the interesting thing – there’s some theatre in this that I think we should cover with your viewers – and that
is that the Treasurer earlier in the week said “You don’t use up political mileage on this topic anymore”. You
have the premier of NSW, with the Prime Minister behind him, talking about GST. <On-screen article
appears: GST reform push has four premiers on board>. We’ve had the Henry tax review since 2010 which
is the blueprint to look at everything.
TRIOLI: Yes.
MALLEY: And we are six months behind on our tax review so this is really the Clayton’s tax review at the
moment. And good on Mike Baird – he’s got credibility – he’s talked to tough issues in NSW. He raised
‘electricity’, of all topics, leading into the last election. So he has political mileage and he’s having a go. It’s
going to be an interesting session. Well at least they’ve got classic research to work from.
ROWLAND: Classic indeed – CPA’s research.
TRIOLI: So, you were talking about 20% weren’t you?
MALLEY: We gave a range. We did 10% as is, just raising it to 15% as Mike Baird raised -- by the way
that’s about $110 billion over 4 years. And we did the analysis to say $20 billion of that could go back into
welfare support, and $80 billion could retire other taxes. So I think it’s the issue of the politicians’ credibility
that makes the GST debate so difficult. The actual numbers are very testable and an important part of the
debate.
ROWLAND: And it goes to a point – a lot of long-time political observers, like our very own Barry Cassidy,
have been depressed for quite a while now about the lack of policy bravery in Australia and Mike Baird, in
doing this, is harking back to the John Howards, Paul Keatings… actually being willing to go out there and
prosecute the case for controversial policy reform.
MALLEY: Yes… and Bob Hawke. We all remember people who made tough decisions that may not affect
their electoral cycle and Mike Baird is probably the one at the moment who has done that. The shame of it
is that some of the politics around it is saying this was an Abbott-Baird thing. I think Baird is his own man
and I think he has made a decision to go out there and say, at least raise this topic.
TRIOLI: Let’s have a look at the Bronwyn Bishop issue – you’ve got a story there in the Herald Sun that
you want to have a look at and a few other things as well.
MALLEY: <On-screen article appears: Probation for Bishop – Labor vows to pursue speaker’s demerits>
Well I think on the basis of credibility and perception of politicians’ this hasn’t helped the cause. This
probation article that you can see on the screen – we don’t know what ‘probation’ means. In business we
have a ‘code of conduct’.
TRIOLI: Means she can’t drink and drive?
MALLEY: [Laughs] Yes, well she doesn’t need to. Basically in this situation we are looking at a probation
but we don’t know what that is. A perception that’s really not helpful in our view of politicians. The aviation
industry would like it of course – they’d be the only ones that would. And fundamentally it’s now the butt of
jokes on social media. And that’s not helpful to the brand of politics.
TRIOLI: There have been quite a few memes doing the rounds on Twitter in the last 24 hours. There’s a
couple: Bronwyn Bishop watering the garden <Meme on-screen depicting Elvis – the Firefighting helicopter,
#choppergate>
MALLEY: So it’s not as if it hasn’t been useful on some fronts <laughs>. But look, that’s the very essence
of what you don’t want in your political environment.
TRIOLI & ROWLAND: <Agree> No.
TRIOLI: When you start getting mocked, you’re really at the end of it.
ROWLAND: You’re in dangerous territory.
TRIOLI: As someone who is very interested in the issue of governance, how do you think the entitlement
issue should be recast?
MALLEY: I think you’ve got to have a really public document that outlines very clearly what the processes
are, and then you’ve got to have a monitoring system and ultimately a punitive model if people breach the
code. The problem is that I think everyone is tentative in politics, because these sorts of things, people can
cross over a line minimally but when we are playing a purity game, you no longer can comment on the
Bronwyn Bishop issue because you might have done something slightly different. So I think you’ve got to
have what we have in business: a code of conduct, people across the code of conduct, there’s a process
and there’s an outcome.
ROWLAND: Accountabilities.
MALLEY: Absolutely. And Abbott has been big on accountabilities and this ‘probation’ thing – we’re not
quite sure what that is.
ROWLAND: Let’s go to the Financial Review – it has a story that has long concerned you and your industry
Alex – the drift-away of young men in terms of studying science and mathematics.
MALLEY: Yes, that’s really important to our society. <On-screen article appears: Drift from STEM subjects
alarms industry>. We’ve dug every hole we can in Western Australia with the mining and this is the whole
STEM issue – that there’s a drop in STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Maths) and it’s a real
issue for our nation because innovation knowledge is where the future is for our country… and kids aren’t
going there. And I have to say, throughout my schooling, I went to science classes begrudgingly, and I think
it’s a fantastic subject if it’s taught well and I’d call on all people who want to be teachers (which I had been
for 20 years prior to this life) is to be passionate about science – because if you’re a great teacher, you can
attract young people to that area and we need it desperately.
TRIOLI: I’ve written my column on this very subject this week, so I’ll put it up on Twitter today and people
can take a look at it as well. It’s an area of great interest to me too.
Let’s have a look at the story that you’ve got in the Guardian online. I heard this story on radio this morning
and I couldn’t believe it – are people actually having to battle hard to try and raise the money to preserve
Neil Armstrong’s spacesuit?
MALLEY: Well, I thought I’d link to this to STEM <refers to on-screen article showing “Museum seeks to
save Neil Armstrong’s spacesuit with $500,000 Kickstarter”> because this is Mr STEM. This is the person
we link to brave new frontiers, innovation, taking a risk, and so on. But yes, there is an attempt here for
crowdfunding to raise half a million dollars to preserve his suit that is deteriorating and hasn’t been on
public display since 2006.
TRIOLI: Is it in the Smithsonian?
MALLEY: Yes, somewhere.
TRIOLI: So why can’t the Smithsonian afford it?
ROWLAND: Yes, why not?
MALLEY: Well, that’s for the Smithsonian but suffice to say that they are out there trying to raise funds and
we are going to develop some support for it ourselves as an organisation because we had that unique
opportunity to meet with him. In many ways, we should use this story as a reminder that we’ve slipped on
STEM and it’s very important that we make every effort there. Now there is a rumour that they’re going to
try to preserve my suit, as well.
TRIOLI: And you in it? [Laughs]
ROWLAND: And a great suit it is Alex. [Laughs]
MALLEY: And I’m taking care of it. [Laughs]
ROWLAND: And you have personal interest in this because you had an audience with the great man – was
it a couple of years ago in Sydney?
MALLEY: That’s right. He was just the most amazingly humble man.
TRIOLI: And so private. I’m so impressed that you got him out because as you know he has turned down
so many opportunities over the years to come and speak about what he did.
MALLEY: He has… but I spoke nicely [laughs]…polite. But I have to tell you the reason he did it, in the end
it came down to this line that I said to him at lunch –- “Neil, all these children - young people out there,
never saw what you did and the world then was 90% vision and 10% risk management. Today the world is
90% risk management and 10% vision. You have to tell these young people about what you did. And it was
on that line that he said, “Okay”.
TRIOLI: Well, I reckon you should spearhead the campaign to get that money raised.
ROWLAND: I reckon.
MALLEY: I’m going to help.
ROWLAND: You’re a force of nature Alex. If anybody can do it, you can.
MALLEY: [Laughs] I have been called worse.
TRIOLI: But can I just say that a lot of wealthy people in the United States – $500,000 – Come on! You’d
find that behind the couch.
MALLEY: It’s true – with the sort of salaries that go on at the ABC.
TRIOLI: Exactly. All the time.
ROWLAND: [Laughs] All the time.
TRIOLI: Nice to see you Alex. Thanks so much.
MALLEY: Lovely to see you.
ENDS