10/20/2016 Humic Acid [Archive] THCtalk.com Cannabis Growing Forum & Cannabis & Marijuana Discussion Forums THCtalk.com Cannabis Growing Forum & Cannabis & Marijuana Discussion Forums > Introduction and Cannabis Basics > Organic Growing > Humic Acid PDA View Full Version : Humic Acid sivadavi 270712, 03:09 AM Hi guys! Took a trip to the hydro store to get a couple of things. One was biobizz Root Juice...then I saw the price! Holy shit! So went home to research a bit. Apparently one main ingredient is Humic acid which you can get a lot cheaper in powder form. Does anyone use this to supplement or as an ingredient in compost teas? Here's some info on what it is: What is Humus or Humic Acid? The term "humus" dates back to the time of the Romans, when it was frequently used to designate the soil as a whole. It was later applied to the organic matter of soils and composts, or to different fractions of this organic matter; as well as, to complexes formed from a variety of natural organic substances. Humus compounds are complex natural organic compounds that are formed in soils from plant residues, by a process of "humification". Humus materials are complex aggregate of brown to dark colored amorphous substances, which have originated during the decomposition of plant and animal residues by microorganisms, under aerobic and anaerobic conditions, in soils, composts, peat bogs, and water basins. Chemically, humus consists of certain constituents of the original plant material resistant to further decomposition; of substances undergoing decomposition; of complexes resulting from decomposition, either by processes of hydrolysis or by oxidation and reduction; and of various compounds synthesized by microorganisms. "Humic acid " is the commercial term often used to refer to the combined humic and fulvic acid content found in these naturally occurring deposits. Humic acid is known to be among the most biochemically active materials found in soil. Why Use Humic Acid? Today, there is a recognized and increasing use of humic acids for their beneficial impact on the growth and cultivation of crops (vegetable & nonvegetable), citrus, turf, flowers, and particularly in organicallydeficient soils. Humic acid is not a fertilizer as it does not directly provide nutrients to plants, but is a compliment to fertilizer. Benefits include: Addition of organic matter to organicallydeficient soils Increase root vitality Improved nutrient uptake Increased chlorophyll synthesis Better seed germination Increased fertilizer retention Stimulate beneficial microbial activity Healthier plants and improved yields How Does Humic Acid Improve Soil? When applied to clay soils, humic acid can help break up compacted soils, allowing for enhanced water penetration and better root zone growth and development. When applied to sandy soils, humic acid adds essential organic material necessary for water retention thus improving root growth and enhancing the sandy soil's ability to retain and not leach out vital plant nutrients. How Does Humic Acid Improve Plant Growth? As mentioned above, one way plant growth is improved is through the structural improvement of both clay and sandy soil allowing for better root growth development. Plant growth is also improved by the ability of the plant to uptake and receive more nutrients. Humic acid is especially beneficial in freeing up nutrients in the soil so that they are made available to the plant as needed. For instance if an aluminum molecule is binded with a phosphorus one, humic acid detaches them making the phosphorus available for the plant. Humic acid is also especially important because of its ability to chelate micronutrients increasing their bio availability. How Does Humic Acid Effect Microbial Activity and What is its Role? The activities of beneficial soil microbes are crucial for the sustainability of any soil and plant growth. Humic acid stimulates microbial activity by providing the indigenous microbes with a carbon source for food, thus encouraging their growth and activity. Soil microbes are responsible for solubilizing vital nutrients such as phosphorus that can then be absorbed by the humic acid and in turn made available to the plant. Additionally, microbes are responsible for the continued development of humus in the soil as it continues to break down not fully decomposed organic matter. This insitu production of humus continues to naturally add to the humic acid base and its benefits. Humic Acid's Role in Fertilization http://www.thctalk.com/cannabisforum/archive/index.php/t76458.html 1/4 10/20/2016 Humic Acid [Archive] THCtalk.com Cannabis Growing Forum & Cannabis & Marijuana Discussion Forums Humic acid is technically not a fertilizer, although in some walks people do consider it that. Humic acid is an effective agent to use as a complement to synthetic or organic fertilizers. In many instances, regular humic acid use will reduce the need for fertilization due to the soil's and plant's ability to make better use of it. In some occurrences, fertilization can be eliminated entirely if sufficient organic material is present and the soil can become self sustaining through microbial processes and humus production. LBN 270712, 03:20 AM Some good info there. thanks sivadavi 270712, 04:20 AM Here's some more good info on the different types that are sold. Different sources of humates will have different ratios of bio active components, something to look out for! I'm still in search of a good, cheap option. Terminology of Humusrelated Materials Humusproduct resulting from decay of organic matter. Contains both humic and nonhumic material. Huminthe alkaliinsoluble fraction of leonardite. (The usage of this term does not correspond exactly with the usage by other workers.) . Humic substances(plural) the collective name for the acid radicals found in humic matter. Typically separated from humic matter by alkaline extraction. Humic acid(singular) the acid radical found in humic matter which is soluble in alkali but insoluble in acid, methyl ethyl ketone, and methyl alcohol. Humatethe salts of humic acids, collectively, or the salts of humic acid specifically. (The usage must be determined from the context.) Fulvic acidthe acid radical found in humic matter which is soluble in alkali, acid, methyl ethyl ketone, and methyl alcohol. Fulvatesthe salts of fulvic acid. Leonarditea soft brown coallike deposit usually found in conjunction with deposits of lignite. Lignitea type of soft coal. WHY ARE HUMATES IMPORTANT? Humates are considered commercially available forms of humic matter for use in agriculture, environmental, industrial, livestock and human wellbeing. Humates are in essence the salts of humic and fulvic acids. Humic compounds make up the bulk of organic matter in the World’s soils. Through millions of years compaction of plant and animal material, this material can be found Worldwide. Humic matter comes from a variety of sources including aquatic environments, geologic deposits and wetlands. Humic matter is also created from agricultural, industrial and municipal activities. Humates have been used in agriculture for many years, possibly thousands of years by early corn, squash and bean farmers in the Southwest U.S. In other countries, humic and fulvic acid use has been ongoing for many years with continual dollars put into research. However, In the U.S. there has been much misinformation regarding the use of humates, unintentionally spread by suppliers, distributors and marketers who are not scientists and who do not understand the humate research available (this is also due to lack of uniform testing, which we will go into later). Only in the last decade or so have we even understood how humates work. We now talk of an auxinlike response, not really knowing what causes it. It was never realized how effective humate was at very low application rates and how much soil change it can effect in a short time. Stimulation of biomass production at the bottom of the food chain is a part of the benefit of humates. Release of essential minerals from the soil for plant uptake is part of this process. Result of Humate depletion Humic acids are crucial to life on earth and when they become depleted via oxidation or deactivated by sodium or aluminum, soil problems develop and can cause negative effects all the way up the food chain. Conditions of soil depletion resulting in low yield and/or susceptibility to diseases and pests have resulted in devastating effects for many civilizations of the past. Once humus (organic matter) is depleted, trace element availability along with phosphorus and calcium availability starts to decline. Anthropologists have observed this in many ancient civilizations. Human skeletons have shown the effects of deficiencies such as dental problems, osteoporosis and bone degeneration possibly resulting in many dying at young ages. When zinc is depleted learning ability is lost in the population along with fertility, and that is the end of that civilization. Analyzing the bone of the “mound builder” civilization of the U.S. Midwest has proved this. Bones found at the bottom of the mounds were in good health, whereas those found towards the top of the burials (or the end of the mound builders civilization) teeth and bone problems were very apparent through analysis of lowlevel zinc, calcium and phosphorus mineral content. Therefore, we can learn about mistakes of past civilizations concerning the need for improving agricultural soils through use of humate product, but are we doing enough in this country to reduce this problem? Other countries of the world are becoming more and more interested in humates, have completed largescale research projects in many areas of http://www.thctalk.com/cannabisforum/archive/index.php/t76458.html 2/4 10/20/2016 Humic Acid [Archive] THCtalk.com Cannabis Growing Forum & Cannabis & Marijuana Discussion Forums humic use and have incorporated use of humates into their agricultural practices with much success. UNDERSTANDING THE DIFFERENCE Various forms of raw humus and humates exist including those produced by composting, industrial byproducts and those created during ancient geological events. However, for the purpose of using humates and derivatives including humic and fulvic acids, we will provide a brief overview of what you, the buyer of products, should understand if you want the best product for your money. When shopping around, it is in your best interest to know where a company sources their raw materials, processing methods, their scientific knowledge of the products and scientific research documents to back their claims. We encourage you to explore this and remember that price is not the most important factor when deciding on a product. There's a lot of junk out there so buyer beware! What's The Differences? Leonardite, coal or fossilized peat? Leonardite refers to slack (oxidized) lignite; typically found in North Dakota, Wyoming and other locations around the world [the term was first coined by Dr. Leonard at the University of ND]. This exact material has a good amount of humic, but is lower in fulvic. However, now this term has spread and many people refer to humates in general as Leonardite. BioAg uses a carbonaceous shale or mudstone. Even in this formation the quality varies according to geological time of deposit or depth. A couple hundred feet this way or that and you probably have a different quality of material. Our raw material contains imprints of plants. In basic terms, our humate is fossilized peat from broad leaved freshwater plants. Leonardite is salt water reed/sedge based. Why is this important to distinguish? Bottom line is the bioactivity of the final product (humic and fulvic acid products). Analysis of various forms of humates from different sources have been conducted. Results show that BioAg's material contains 12% bioactive fulvic acid based ore whereas true Leonardite contains approximately 8% fulvic acid and high humic (up to 80%). However, unlike many claim, bioactivity is low...this form of humate material is great for drilling mud, not for bioactive products. Similarly, many Chinese and German humates are slack lignite and they recommend 10 times what BioAg recommends to achieve similar results. Even worse are companies in the Eastern U.S. and many Canadian suppliers offering coalbased humates; toxic waste products from coal mining that they do not tell you about (See Warning Below). 2. Form, molecular weight and biological activity The best humate is one that is high in biological activity, fulvic/humic acids, silicic acids and also high in oxygen in the phenolic and quinoid groups. Humic acids function best in the low weight fraction (fulvic) on the cellular level. Molecular weight is very important with the high oxygen types usually falling into the low weight (smaller sized molecules) category and thus more biologically active since only low weight molecules are utilized by beneficial organisims, enter cell membranes more efficiently, create greater permeability for the flow of nutrition into the cell and adsorption of excess heavy metals for removal from the cell. In agriculture, stimulation of each cell produces more energy from the plant and higher yield. The process starts with soil microbes, then plant root cells and eventually the entire plant. We can also do this by foliar spraying soluble fulvic acids and adding a humic solution to the soil at planting. Cellular stimulation at all levels is how it works. 3. The Bottom Line & Results? This is an economic issue, boiled down to how much humic acid is one getting per dollar and what is the cellular stimulation level? Consider the fact that the more concentrated a humate product the cheaper it is to transport and apply. Therefore, the most concentrated source is the best buy due to transportation costs alone. Let's take a look at raw humate (before it's solublized and concentrated). A highgrade raw humate might be very effective at raising the yield by 20% or more with just 50lbs per acre of a 7080% humic acid material. A humate of 34% humic requires 250300# per acre of raw material to do the same job. What is the price, what is a pound of humic acid delivered going to be with current freight rates? Get your calculator out! A company claims to have the highest guaranteed humic acid available at 35% humic acids, 35% carbon and 35% organic matter. Is this the highest guaranteed humic material when another company has a product guaranteed at 80% humic acid and one in Washington State has one guaranteed at 70%? Is this misinformation? Consider the standard source of humic acid provided by many suppliers and their distributorsLeonardite, which contains over 80% humic acids. On the surface, this would seem to be the highest. However, this is not the most effective unless it is made into a soluble form where it becomes effective at low rate and the humic acids of the soluble powder can be over 80%. It is also low in the fulvic portion, the bioactive portion. These claims are often misleading, and not the fault of any one company, but a result of lack of testing standardization in our industry. Humates are valuable products, and until our industry can agree on some forms of standardization, only deal with companies with a track record and a proven highgrade product. Tabbatha 270712, 08:03 AM Hi guys! Took a trip to the hydro store to get a couple of things. One was biobizz Root Juice...then I saw the price! Holy shit! So went home to research a bit. Apparently one main ingredient is Humic acid which you can get a lot cheaper in powder form. Yep. Welcome to the wonderful world of being rippedoff more by nutrient dealers than drug http://www.thctalk.com/cannabisforum/archive/index.php/t76458.html 3/4 10/20/2016 Humic Acid [Archive] THCtalk.com Cannabis Growing Forum & Cannabis & Marijuana Discussion Forums dealers :D £9+ del for 1ltr of canna organic ph down (40% citric acid). OR.. £5 inc del for a kilo of citric acid crystals and £2 for a ltr of distilled water, and make an 80% solution for £2 p/ltr. £18+ del for biobizz professional soil that lacks magnesium. £5 for tomato compost and £1 for epsoms salts. I could go on :D Does anyone use this to supplement or as an ingredient in compost teas? I haven't added it in a separate form before now because of my nutrient selections, but it's pretty much found in all good fertlisers, soil and other additives so it's well recognised as a good thing by the big boys. Cheers for posting the info I found that useful to get a few bits from. :) jimmi420 270712, 11:04 AM Humic for soil grows , fulvic for hydro moonlight7 031212, 05:39 AM Thanks for the information guys. humic acid is cheaper, fulvic acid is expensive :leaf: Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.0 Copyright © 2016 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved. http://www.thctalk.com/cannabisforum/archive/index.php/t76458.html 4/4
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