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CITY OF PONTIAC
PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
MAY 6, 2015
6:30 p.m.
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Meeting before The Pontiac
Planning Commission at 47450 Woodward Avenue, Pontiac,
Michigan, on Wednesday, May 6, 2015.
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PRESENT FROM THE CITY:
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Gordon Bowdell, Planner
James Sabo, Planner
c.
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PRESENT FROM THE BOARD
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·,,,.,,
f>
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Dayne Thomas - Chairperson
Mona Par love
Lucy Payne
Ashley Fegley
Mayor Deirdre Waterman
Hazel Cadd
Christopher Northcross
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OTHERS PRESENT:
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Wassaf Jumaa
Dennis Cowan
Joseph A. Munem
Alfred Jordan
Glenn Desimone
Rick Manczak
Rick Burns
Chuck Johnson
Elizabeth Narvaez
Dennis Neff
Larry Dixon
Gary Ingram
John Little
Paul Tulikangas
William Koetting
Linda Hasson
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'~t-
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REPORTED BY:
Mona Storm, CSR# 4460
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INDEX
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ACTION
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MARKED
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1.
Call to Order
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5
2.
Roll Call
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3.
Motion to Approve PF-15-23 with
modifications
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4.
5.
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88
Motion approved for mobile food vehicle
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vendor
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Motion for PF-15-27 carries for outdoor
storage
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6.
Motion to approve proposed site plan
PF-15-29
137
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Pontiac, Michigan
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Wednesday, May 6,
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6:30 p.m.
2015
THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Good evening,
ladies and
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gentlemen and welcome to Pontiac Planning Commission
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for Wednesday, May 16,
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items this evening,
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And that generally takes a little bit longer than
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normal,
2015.
There are four agenda
each of which is a public hearing.
as we engage the public speakers.
Nonetheless,
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I ' l l do my best procedurally to ensure that the meeting
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proceeds efficiently and expediently.
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But with respect to time allocation,
I would
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like to ask the public speakers,
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speakers,
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and be respectful of the time,
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behind them,
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fellow commissioners as well as myself,
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point and to not engage in repetitive statements and to
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move on.
to make their case,
the forthcoming public
organize their thoughts
that there are others
other petitioners.
And also I remind my
to make our
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So we want everyone to have ample time to
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state their case and I hope that we move forward to
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have a good meeting.
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I ' l l introduce you,
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that are here.
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So before we go to roll call,
just briefly,
to our commissioners
We have a few that are coming.
But the Associate Planner is Gordon Bowdell
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to my far right.
Commissioner Lucy Payne to my
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immediate right.
To my far left is Commissioner
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Christopher Northcross,
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Cadd.
then -- then Commissioner Hazel
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MS. CADD:
Hi.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
And City Planner,
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James Sabo is to my immediate left.
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Dayne Thomas,
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further ado, may we have roll call, please.
the Chairman.
And I'm
So Mr. Sabo, without
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MR. SABO:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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MR. SABO:
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MS. PAYNE:
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MR. SABO:
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Commissioner Northcross?
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MR. NORTHCROSS:
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MR. SABO:
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Commissioner Cadd?
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MS. CADD:
Present.
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MR. SABO:
Commissioner Thomas?
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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MR. SABO:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
Commissioner Parlove.
She's a no-show.
Commissioner Payne.
Present.
Mayor Waterman?
Present.
Commissioner Fegley?
Present.
All right.
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communications this evening?
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MR. SABO:
Okay.
I have none.
We have a quorum.
Are there any
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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And there are no minutes
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for review so that takes us expediently directly to --
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to our agenda.
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is a public hearing, site plan review/special exception
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permit, auto service facility at 658 Cesar Chavez.
Mr. Bowdell.
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MR. SABO:
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MR. BOWDELL:
Thank you.
As he stated, it's
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PF-15-23, it's a site plan review and a special
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exception permit for 658 Cesar E. Chavez,
zoning is C-3
This is the site here at
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corridor commercial.
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Cesar Chavez and at Montcalm.
Site plan review for a proposed auto service
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facility.
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a three-garage -- or a three-bay here.
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pictures.
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there's no active business license on it.
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seeking to reoccupy it for an auto service.
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This
So our first item up is PF-15-23.
This is the site, it's an existing building,
Zoning is C-3.
Here's a few
It's a vacant building,
And they're
Our --
The existing building meets all standards for
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the building according to our zoning ordinance.
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signs are proposed at the site plan review application.
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Signs are subject to permitting requirements through
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the Building Department.
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and no exterior lighting is proposed at the site.
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No
No tree survey is required
Landscaping, the existing site does not have
any landscaping currently.
It's acquired at five
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1
percent, currently it's zero percent.
For parking lots abutting the right of way,
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they required an 8-foot buffer with two deciduous trees
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on Cesar Chavez and three on West Montcalm.
The parking lot extends all the way to the
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sidewalk and the right-of-way,
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as well.
The street trees, which are in the actual
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so this is nonconforming
right-of-way between the sidewalk and the street,
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they're required four;
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West Montcalm.
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That is nonconforming.
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two on Cesar Chavez and two on
Currently all four are on Cesar Chavez.
For a waste receptacle enclosure, it's
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required for a masonry wall with a gate.
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proposed a fence that is nonconforming.
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They have
Outdoor storage of any vehicle under repair
is limited to three days.
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Parking -- it meets all parking requirements
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for the number of spaces required,
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proposed,
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Single striping was identified on the site plan,
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barrier-free parking spots, they have one proposed,
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however it does not conform to the regulations of a
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an 8 by 20,
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they have five,
the -- the required for double striping.
actually,
this is a typo.
8 by 20 and an eight-foot aisle is required
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to have a 9 by 20 and two four-foot aisles.
These are the special exception permit
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I won't
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conditions for an automobile service facility.
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go over these but it meets all of these standards.
The outdoor storage,
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as I mentioned before,
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is limited to three bays for storing vehicles under
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repair.
Standards for approval for -- for
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discretionary approval from Section 6.303 of the zoning
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ordinance states that -- that the Planning Commission
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must find that the use will:
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1.
Be harmonious and -- harmonious with and
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in accordance with general principles and objectives of
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the comprehensive Master Plan meets;
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standard.
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entrepreneurial,
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this land use classification is designated (sic)
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create more flexibility to attract creative and
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motivational local entrepreneurs.
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the proposed draft would meet that.
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it meets that
The Master Plan identifies the parcel as
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industrial commercial and green.
Be designed,
And
to
And it appears that
constructed and operated,
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maintained so as to be harmonious in appearance;
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meets that standard.
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auto service facility.
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reoccupy that existing facility.
it
The property was developed as an
They're just seeking to
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3.
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Not change the essential character of the
Mainly because it's
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area; meets that standard as well.
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a reoccupancy and it does not seem that it would have a
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negative impact on the development or redevelopment of
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the surrounding neighborhood.
4.
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Not be hazardous or disturbing to
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existing or future uses; it meets that standard.
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is always an active concern with the storage of
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vehicles under repair.
Although the site is large
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enough to accommodate the vehicles,
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comply with that three-day period for storage.
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5.
There
the applicant must
Be served adequately by essential public
facilities and services; it meets that standard.
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6.
Not involve uses,
activities, processes,
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materials and equipment or conditions of the operation
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that will be detrimental to any person, property or
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general welfare; mainly, that standard the applicant
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must ensure that grease, oil interceptors installed in
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any catch basin at the site.
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7.
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The planning analysis, as I stated,
Meets that standard.
it's a
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re-occupancy for this building.
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appears to meet those standards from Sections 6.303 of
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the Zoning Ordinance as well as 2.309 of the Zoning
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Ordinance.
It -- the proposed use
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The site does not comply with the landscaping
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requirements because it is existing.
A minimum of five
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percent is required,
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landscaping, between the street and the parking lot,
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the applicant would have to remove that parking lot in
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order to get that landscaping in there.
zero is existing.
The parking lot
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It is recommended that the planning
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commission use their authority to modify that
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landscaping requirement for the applicant.
And then at
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such time that the applicant pursues to redo their
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parking lot,
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time.
they would put in the landscaping at that
Street trees are required.
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It is recommended
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that they comply with that requirement for the two
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additional street trees on West Montcalm.
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Parking lot,
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barrier-free standard.
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enclosure is required to be masonry,
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they should comply with that standard as well.
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they must comply with the
Based on that,
And finally,
the dumpster
not a fence and
the recommendation is to
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approve with the modifications of the site landscaping
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from five percent to zero percent and the reduction of
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parking lot landscaping.
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compliance conditions listed 1 through 7 for the street
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trees,
And subject to those -- these
the dumpster enclosure,
the parking lot
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striping, the barrier-free space and the storage of
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vehicles.
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4
I can answer any
That is my report.
questions and I believe the applicant is here.
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MR.
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MR. BOWDELL:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Please come forward.
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MR. JUMAA:
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JUMAA:
Yeah,
Applicant is here as well.
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for the record, please.
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MR.
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Thank you,
State your name and address
My address -- my home address,
business address?
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Whichever address you
prefer or your business address.
MR.
JUMAA:
My first name is Wassaf,
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name Jumaa.
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in Dearborn Heights, Michigan.
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last
My address is 26543 Midway Street; that's
THE CHAIRPERSON:
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spell your first name?
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MR.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Mr. Bowdell.
Yeah.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
JUMAA:
I'm right here.
JUMAA:
Thank you.
How do you
Wassaf, W-A-S-S-A-F.
Good evening, Wassaf.
Thank you for coming.
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MR. JUMAA:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
You heard Mr. Bowdell's
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presentation of your case.
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MR. JUMAA:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Yes,
So anything you'd like to
add or change or modify?
MR.
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JUMAA:
No,
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Anything that needs done,
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that's no problem.
everything was perfect.
I ' l l take care of everything;
THE CHAIRPERSON:
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I did.
everyone.
Okay.
A reminder to
This is a public hearing.
We're going to go
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to my fellow commissioners first for questions or
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comments with the petitioner and then we'll close and
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we'll open public hearing and go there.
So to my far left to Commissioner Northcross,
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please.
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MR. NORTHCROSS:
I'll listen.
Right at this
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time,
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think it was a
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directions and the thrust that we're going to go
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through-- go toward for development and I'm glad to
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hear the applicant is willing to make any changes
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that's needed.
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point.
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I don't see anything that jumps out at me.
you know,
I
fits in with our -- our
So I really-- I'll just listen at this
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Good.
Thank you,
Commissioner Northcross.
Commissioner Cadd, please.
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2
I only have one question at this
MS. CADD:
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time, please.
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MR. JUMAA:
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MS. CADD:
Yes?
That is,
under the special
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exception permit vehicles to be serviced shall not
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exceed 9,000 pounds.
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tons.
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rigs?
MR.
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JUMAA:
MS. CADD:
No,
nothing over that.
Okay.
That was my question.
Thank you.
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four and a half
Do you plan to do a lot of work on those big
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That's what,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you very much.
Commissioner Parlove, welcome.
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MS.
PARLOVE:
Thank you.
And thank you for
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coming.
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that you do in Pontiac as far as a business?
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To
A couple questions.
MR. JUMAA:
Do you have anything else
I do work at an automotive shop
in Pontiac.
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MS.
PARLOVE:
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MR.
JUMAA:
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MS.
PARLOVE:
Is i t your own shop?
It's my brother's.
When I was looking at the
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photograph that was provided, the aerial and having
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been at the site today,
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behind the store.
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MR.
there's a collection of tires
Do those belong to you?
JUMAA:
Those are going to be moved.
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1
Yeah,
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leaving them there for now.
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moved to different locations.
MS.
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PARLOVE:
Those are going to be
Okay.
Yeah.
And then behind the
fencing that is north of your property --
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MR. JUMAA:
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MS.
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I'm just
those aren't going to stay there.
Yes?
PARLOVE:
quite a collection of cars.
Do those belong to you as well?
MR.
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JUMAA:
No,
no cars on that lot are mine.
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People are actually parking there from next door or the
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party store.
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MS.
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MR. JUMAA:
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MS.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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PARLOVE:
PARLOVE:
Okay.
That was it.
Thank you.
Thank you.
And to Commissioner Payne,
please.
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MS.
PAYNE:
Good evening.
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MR.
JUMAA:
Good evening.
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MS.
PAYNE:
Thank you for your interest in
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Pontiac business.
I have a few questions.
One is, Gordon, could you go back to the
building, please, the -- yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
Do you have any plans or are there any plans
of updating the appearance?
MR. JUMAA:
Definitely,
yeah.
Yes,
the glass
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is going to be changed, everything is going to be
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cleaned up.
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there is a lot of work that still needs to be done to
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the building to make it more presentable.
The lot,
MS.
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PAYNE:
it's going to be striped.
Okay.
So
And you agree that five
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parking spaces really isn't enough for the amount of
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business?
MR.
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JOMAA:
spaces than five there that
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MS.
FEGLEY:
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MR.
JUMAA:
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MS.
FEGLEY:
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Well,
MR.
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possible.
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everything,
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay.
JUMAA:
As soon as,
you know,
FEGLEY:
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MR.
JUMAA:
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MS.
FEGLEY:
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MR.
JUMAA:
Yes.
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MS.
PAYNE:
Okay.
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As soon as
I'm done with
so --
MS.
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And on what date are you
You know what?
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23
you know.
planning on opening the operation?
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22
there's a lot more parking
Okay.
So
I'm hoping within a month or two.
A month or two?
Yes, ma'am.
And my understanding,
you
do agree with all of the recommendations?
MR.
JUMAA:
I agree with anything you guys
PAYNE:
Okay.
need me to do.
MS.
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MR.
JUMAA:
Thank you.
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MS.
PAYNE:
Okay.
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MR.
JUMAA:
Thank you.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
3
6
that's all I
have.
Thank you.
To Vice Chair
Fegley, please.
No comments.
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MS.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Thank you 1
FEGLEY:
Okay.
once again for coming tonight.
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just briefly,
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business.
Wassaf,
thank you
I'll kind of explain
I know you're in the auto service
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MR.
JUMAA:
Yes.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
What kind of -- what is
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your kind of business, more cars, trucks,
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the two,
heavy repair,
light repair, more tires?
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MR. JUMAA:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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MR.
JUMAA:
a grouping of
It's mostly light repair.
Okay.
You know,
it's mostly
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alternators, starters, empty gas tanks, brakes.
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don't do that many motor changing but mostly minor car
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repairs,
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I
nothing heavy.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
So probably with regard to
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parking spaces, you're not looking-- you're not kind
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of like an in/out loop facility where you got a train
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of cars that probably the parking that's laid out here
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1
is sufficient for you for the business that you're
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looking to operate?
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MR. JUMAA:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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Gordon,
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Cesar Chavez, right?
Yes,
MR. BOWDELL:
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
12
MR. BOWDELL:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
Those are,
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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They are existing?
Okay.
And then over on
There's zero.
And are trees proposed for
there?
MR. BOWDELL:
No.
The recommendation is that
they plant two trees in the West Montcalm area.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
I'm sorry, the
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recommendation is to plant two?
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MR. BOWDELL:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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probably to the center space there?
25
existing.
Montcalm there are -MR. BOWDELL:
19
actually,
Yes.
15
18
Those are proposed trees,
correct?
MR. BOWDELL:
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With regard to,
Correct.
10
14
Okay.
it looks like we've got trees along
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it's perfect actually.
MR. BOWDELL:
Two, correct.
Okay.
So in that space and
Yeah, and maybe two here and
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1
one here and I forgot where his property line is.
2
here and maybe down here.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
3
4
MR. JUMAA:
6
THE CHAIRPERSON:
just one
Yes?
Mostly just you as an
employee or a couple others?
MR. JUMAA:
8
9
And Wassaf,
last question.
5
7
Okay.
One
Well,
I have a couple brothers,
two brothers, that, you know, they both work on cars so
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they're going to be working with me.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
12
questions.
13
further ado,
Okay.
Okay.
Those are my
And this is a public hearing so without
the public hearing is over.
As the stampede continues, before it gets out
14
15
of control, we're going to close down public hearing.
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Okay.
17
me.
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Christopher Northcross, any further questions
before we go to the motion?
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21
With that being said, may we have -- or excuse
MR. NORTHCROSS:
spaces?
Again, how many parking
I see --
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MR. BOWDELL:
23
MR. NORTHCROSS:
24
by the building and two out front?
25
MR. BOWDELL:
Five are -Five are planned, okay.
Correct.
Two
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MR. NORTHCROSS:
1
And the other areas in
2
front,
even though there may be cars parked there,
3
they're not formal parking spaces and the cars are just
4
moving in transit?
5
MR. JUMAA:
Yes.
6
MR. NORTHCROSS:
7
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
Okay.
That's it.
Unless there are any
8
further comments or questions, may we have a motion,
9
please.
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MS. FEGLEY:
I move to approve the proposed
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site plan/special exception permit PF-15-23 for the
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automotive service facility as proposed, it meets the
13
standards and appears to meet the sections from 6.303
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and 2.509 of the zoning ordinance with the following
15
modifications:
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landscaping from five percent to zero percent and
17
reduce limited to requiring the parking lot ever
18
abutting the right-of-way and subject to the following
19
conditions listed 1 through 7.
Reduction of the requirement site
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Do you want me to read them or --
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
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And may we have
a second, please.
23
MS. CADD:
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
Thank you.
second.
Second.
So we have a move and a
Any further comments or questions before we go
19
1
to roll call?
2
Mr.
Sabo,
3
MR.
SABO:
4
MS.
FEGLEY:
5
MR.
SABO:
6
MS. CADD:
Yes.
7
MR. SABO:
Commissioner Parlove?
8
MS.
PARLOVE:
9
MR.
SABO:
10
MS.
PAYNE:
11
MR. SABO:
12
MR. NORTHCROSS:
13
MR.
14
THE CHAIRPERSON:
15
MR.
16
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
MR.
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THE CHAIRPERSON:
SABO:
SABO:
JUMAA:
roll call, please.
Commissioner Fegley?
Yes.
Commissioner Cadd.
Yes.
Commissioner Payne.
Yes.
Commissioner Northcross.
Yes.
Chair Thomas?
Yes.
Motion carries.
Wassaf, good luck to you.
Thank you.
Congratulations.
Let us
19
know if we can help,
20
good neighbor to our existing businesses there and
21
they'll be a good neighbor back to you.
and I know you will.
22
MR. JUMAA:
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
I definitely will.
Thank you.
But be a
Thank you.
Okay.
To Item
24
Number 2 we go,
25
site plan review/special exception permit, again.
is PF-15-27,
once again public hearing
20
1
Outdoor storage yard at 888/900 Baldwin Avenue.
2
Mr. Sabo will present.
MR. SABO:
3
And
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
As you
4
mentioned a file number, this is a site plan special
5
exception for 888 Baldwin, outdoor storage Section
6
2.520 in the M-2 General Industrial District.
The note at the bottom here, Siting and
7
8
location for solid waste transfer facilities is
9
governed by Part 115 of the Natural Resource and
10
Environmental Protection Act, MCL subsection 324.11501.
11
As such,
12
retains the authority for location of the facility and
13
has been approved subject to the compliance with
14
applicable local zoning ordinance provisions.
the Oakland County Solid Waste Management Plan
15
What we are viewing tonight are the standards
16
and provisions that are outside of the Part 115
17
authority.
18
So that is the outdoor storage.
This is the site as proposed.
The transfer
19
facility's at the rear of the site, the far rear of the
20
site, it actually encroaches the rear property line.
21
The Baldwin Road entrance is here and truck
22
traffic through the site in this manner.
23
elevation drawings, site photos.
24
25
It's the
This is looking east, east as well.
to the south.
This is
The southeast and that's northwest and
21
1
this is from Baldwin.
2
of the property.
That's the facility at the rear
Zoning is M-2, General Industrial District,
3
4
it's a vacant former automotive manufacturing facility.
5
The Land Use Map is Entrepreneurial,
6
Commercial and Green.
Industrial,
It complies with the 2014 Master Plan Update
7
Industrial, Commercial and Green.
The uses
8
as stated,
9
are generally more flexible than they had been in the
10
previous Master Plan related to some of our former
11
industrial sites here in Pontiac.
12
In summary, it
the designation does allow
13
greater flexibility and the Planning Commission may
14
wish to consider the Master Plan in its decision.
Applicant intends to construct indoor solid
15
16
waste transfer facilities and auto and truck storage at
17
the site.
18
building, anticipated future use of the west building,
19
along Baldwin, is a single-stream recycling facility
20
for use by Pontiac residents.
21
No use at this time proposed for the west
This is the proposed and existing buildings,
22
reuse of that rear building, the east building, new
23
tipping floor construction of a 12-foot push wall, new
24
truck scales, translucent Kalwall panels, tuckpointing
25
the mortar joints, new concrete surrounds at the base
22
1
of the bay, metal roofing, gutters, downspouts, wall
2
pack and new office building near the truck scale.
3
This is all conforming.
As I mentioned, you
4
can see there the rear -- the building encroaches the
5
rear setback, so --
6
Exterior
Tree survey, an untreated site.
They
7
lighting will have to comply with 4.502.
8
submitted a photometric plan that does show
9
conformance.
10
11
12
Trash Receptacle has not been shown as part
of the site plan; that is nonconforming.
Over
Landscaping, five percent required.
13
five percent proposed and existing at the site.
14
deciduous trees, they have 16.
12
15
Again, the dumpster enclosure.
16
That number of parking spaces required is 92,
17
18 spaces shown.
18
requested of the Planning Commission a modification
19
subject to 4.304.
20
That's nonconforming.
They have
The rest is -- is conforming.
All right.
2.520, Outdoor Storage.
These
21
are the standards:
22
limited to areas other than the required front setback
23
and hidden by an eight-foot obscuring fence;
24
meet that standard.
25
Outdoor storage material shall be
it does
There shall be no burning of refuse except in
23
No incinerator meets that standard.
1
an incinerator.
2
No incinerator at the site.
3
Special exception permit standards for 2.520.
4
This is the 6.303 standard:
Harmonious with
5
and in accordance with general principles.
6
use change appears to comply.
7
Master Plan are flexible.
8
standards,
9
storage.
10
Proposed
The standard for the
The zoning ordinance
it meets for those as well for the outdoor
Designed, constructed, operated and
11
maintained to be harmonious and appropriate;
12
to meet that standard as well.
13
manufacturing facility and the proposed use is quite a
14
bit less intense and the hours of operation are more
15
limited than the former GM facility.
16
it appears
It was a former
Not change the essential character of the
17
area;
18
use will somewhat change the character as it's
19
currently vacant but the proposed use is to occupy the
20
site and begin activity, probably less intense or
21
certainly less intense than the GM use.
22
23
24
25
it may meet the standard as well.
The proposed
Not be hazardous or disturbing to existing or
future uses;
it meets that standard.
Served adequately by public facilities;
meets that standard.
it
24
And 6,
1
not involve activities, processes or
2
materials that will be detrimental to any person or the
3
general welfare;
4
applicant should be required to mitigate any dust,
5
fumes,
6
have provided a letter this evening that addresses some
7
of these issues to the Planning Commission.
noise,
10
smoke,
In summary,
8
9
it appears to meet that standard.
odors related to the site.
The
They
it -- the special exception
permit meets all the standards for the special
exception permit for an outdoor storage.
It's an M-2 General Industrial Zoned
11
12
District, compatible with the zoning ordinance on the
13
site.
14
The only real issue is they need 92 parking
15
spaces and they're proposing eighteen.
We've proposed
16
a compromise of 30; 15 for the front use,
17
rear use.
15 for the
It's a little bit ironic that they need a
18
19
dumpster enclosure but they -- they do as part of the
20
requirements for the site plan.
21
but it is what it is.
So that seems unusual
22
Applicant states they have an occupant load
23
of about 13 to 15 employees, which is why they feel a
24
modification is allowable.
25
spaces.
They don't need 92 parking
We feel that 30 would be sufficient;
15 front,
25
1
15 in the rear.
The recommendation here is to approve site
2
I won't read all of these but
3
plan/special exception.
4
the conditions for trash receptacle, modification of
5
the parking spaces and in compliance with the other
6
city standards.
That's my report.
7
8
9
10
The applicants are here as
well.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you, Mr. Sabo.
May the applicant please come forward.
11
while we're waiting for them,
12
Honorable Mayor Dr. Waterman.
13
MAYOR WATERMAN:
14
THE CHAIRPERSON:
15
MR. SABO:
16
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
18
And
I'll welcome the
Good evening.
Good evening.
Good evening, Mayor.
Please state your name and
address for the record, please.
MR. COWAN:
Dennis Cowan, 38505 Woodward in
19
Bloomfield Hills and I'm with the law firm of Plunkett
20
and Cooney,
21
and our team who is here this evening.
22
representing Rizzo Environmental Services
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you,
Dennis.
You
23
heard Mr. Sabo's presentation of the case that you're
24
representing.
25
MR. COWAN:
Yes.
26
THE CHAIRPERSON:
1
So how would you like to
2
add to or modify or change any
3
MR. COWAN:
There's just a couple things and
4
I would,
if you don't mind,
5
and since they all come out,
6
them briefly.
Al Jordan,
also for DPW,
our Municipal Affairs manager and
Director for the City of Detroit.
Rick Burns with NTH Consultants, our
11
12
just want to introduce
for Rizzo.
9
10
I
Joe Munem, director of Governmental Affairs
7
8
I brought a team with me
engineer.
13
Glenn Desimone,
14
And Rick Manczak, my colleague in the legal
15
profession who's been handling many of the submittals
16
for Oakland County and the MDEQ.
17
our architect of record.
Just briefly, we agree with Mr.
Sabo's
18
assessment and the review by the Planning Department.
19
We have worked very,
20
months.
21
not going to Kennett Road.
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
MR. COWAN:
very closely in the last 18
I do want to make one statement to you.
We're
We were here 19 months ago.
Yes.
I was not part of the team but
24
since that time we have worked very diligently,
first
25
identifying a site and one that we believed you would
27
1
also find acceptable, being the old Fiero plant.
And since that time,
2
to give you some
3
context,
it's been 18 or 19 busy months to get here
4
today.
5
room to remember the Beetles song,
6
Road.
7
the Federal Government.
8
the County and the City of Pontiac in a very
9
collaborative manner.
And I think all of us are old enough in the
the Long and Winding
We have been to every level of government except
We've dealt with the State,
We've required to be here before you tonight
10
11
the County Solid Waste Planning Committee approval of
12
an amendment to the County's plan to allow this
13
facility.
14
Oakland County Board of Commissioners with respect to
15
this plan.
16
We've had a unanimous vote of the full
We then,
under State law, had to go and
17
approach all 63 communities and get a two-thirds vote
18
by individual resolution, of which we got 84 percent.
19
We would have done better but we stopped.
20
happened -- what stopped us in August is, when we had
21
as many of you recall,
22
Oakland County and we felt we had enough, we're not
23
going to bother any more communities.
24
25
What
the biblical flood in south
You've had support for this project from
every community in Addison Township in the northeast
28
1
corner of this county to Wixom in the southwest and
2
everybody in between.
I'm pleased to announce that.
We've had MDQ approval of our plan and we
3
But, in order to
4
submitted for a construction permit.
5
get the construction permit, we need to have approval
6
by the Planning Commission and submit that so we can
7
get going.
The benefits for Pontiac will be great.
8
9
We're going to be paying full bore property taxes.
We
And we have
10
are not asking for a tax abatement.
11
entered into a host community agreement which will be
12
of conessence (ph)
13
which will go right to the bottom line of the Pontiac
14
city budget and to assist in doing the things that
15
Pontiac wants to do in the community.
16
proud to be a partner.
tipping fees,
a per tonnage fee
The City Council has passed,
17
And we're very
in addition to
18
the agreements that we have reached, have passed two
19
separate resolutions in support of this plan.
20
So it's an excellent reuse of this former
21
industrial facility.
22
paying our fair share.
23
of the City Council, we're going to provide, at no
24
charge,
25
citizens can bring their recyclables to the -- to the
We're creating jobs.
We're
And we are also, at the request
a citizens' drop-off recycling center where
29
1
front of the building -- to the front of the property.
2
It will be right off an immediate left when you come
3
in.
4
the City wants us to do it.
We're going to do this at no charge for as long as
So we believe this is a -- what was once a --
5
6
a RACER and it is still a RACER Trust property and
7
contaminated under the ground but above ground,
8
going to be a very green facility and we look forward
9
to the opportunity to bring forward to you a
this is
10
single-stream recycling facility in the future.
11
weren't quite ready to bring that before you this
12
evening.
So I'll be glad to answer any questions that
13
14
We
you may have.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
15
nice presentation.
Thank you,
Once again,
Dennis Wilson
16
(sic),
this is a public
17
hearing.
18
full commissioners have had a chance to close their
19
questions.
But we will go to the public, once we -- my
20
So to Commissioner Northcross, please.
21
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yes,
22
I remember following the development with City Council
23
and the resolution that they passed.
24
to follow what was -- follow along the lines of what
25
was presented to the City Council at that time and I
And this appears
30
1
believe there were hearings that were held as part of
2
that resolution.
Just a question.
3
The outdoor containers that
4
are going to be stored, are they going to be -- will
5
there be any
6
mean,
7
or something?
I
will those containers be completely empty, washed
MR. COWAN:
8
9
any type of debris flying about;
Yes.
The protocol for that
operation is those are mostly some related equipment,
10
such as snowplow, things of that nature, other
11
equipment.
12
called ''roll-off containers'',
13
containers that you see dropped at construction sites
14
and things of that nature.
15
But it will mostly be what's commonly
But those will be
which are those large
when they're stored,
16
will be empty on site and they are being put on the
17
other side of the -- what I'll call the ''up front
18
building'' and we're doing that to minimize any dust or
19
anything of that nature into the neighborhood.
20
those will be stored on -- as far away and we could get
21
them -- you know,
22
23
So
reasonably get them on site.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
So they're not going to
be -- they'll just be dumped
24
MR. COWAN:
Right.
25
MR. NORTHCROSS:
but there won't be any
31
1
additional cleansing of the containers done?
MR. COWAN:
2
Well,
I think they'll be washed
3
down from time to time.
4
they're not going to be stored overnight with garbage
5
in them.
6
single-stream and be taken off site to a landfill.
7
8
9
10
But they're not going to be --
That will have to be emptied into the
MR. NORTHCROSS:
And the actual -- I think it
was termed ''tipping floor''?
MR. COWAN:
Yes.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Where the -- where the
11
smaller trucks,
12
packaging into the larger trucks, that's going to still
13
be done in an enclosed building?
14
I guess, unload their cargo for
MR. COWAN:
Yes, all -- all of the trucks
15
that have regular neighborhood refuse from the Oakland
16
County communities, because we service 13 communities,
17
that will be brought to the tipping floor.
18
will follow very stringent MDEQ State regulations.
19
all that activity must occur inside the building and
20
all that refuse must be out of the building by the end
21
of the business day.
22
In fact,
And that
And
we need to get that refuse, at least
23
the -- the garbage, to -- off site and to a landfill or
24
to an incinerator.
25
4:00 and 4:30 in order to get there before 6:00 when
Usually, they'll be leaving between
32
1
these facilities close.
3
I ' l l just listen.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
4
5
I have no other questions.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
2
Thank you, Commissioner
Northcross.
6
To Commissioner Cadd, please.
7
MS. CADD:
8
Thank you.
and your research team.
Thank you,
Mr. Cowan
I do have a few questions.
Mr. Sabo, if you could turn back to the color
9
10
portrait there; that's what I'm familiar with.
11
you're right in my area,
12
MR. COWAN:
13
MS. CADD:
14
middle is Baldwin,
15
right there,
16
coming in at?
17
Because
I'm within a block.
Okay.
Okay.
That first line in the
The one right at the top there,
is that where the trucks are going to be
MR. COWAN:
No.
The trucks are -- yes, all
18
the trucks are going to be coming off Baldwin.
19
pledged to the City and agreed in writing that we are
20
not going to come off of Kennett Road or come through
21
the downtown area with any of the trucks.
22
our trucks are going to have to come down Baldwin Road,
23
ingress and egress to get,
24
facility.
25
MS. CADD:
Okay.
you know,
We have
So all of
in and out of the
But how is it going to get
33
1
to Baldwin; are you coming from the freeway to Baldwin?
MR. COWAN:
2
3
and some will follow Walton from east and west.
4
MS. CADD:
5
MR. COWAN:
6
MS. CADD:
7
MR. COWAN:
8
Montcalm, Columbia or Walton?
Pardon me?
Montcalm, Columbia or Walton?
Our trucks will not go on those
residential streets there.
MS. CADD:
9
10
Some will come from the freeway
They're going to go straight down
Baldwin?
11
MR. COWAN:
12
MS. CADD:
13
Interstate freeway.
14
going to have a lot of heavy trucking, the roads are
15
going to get really torn up.
16
your-- your question to answer.
17
maintain those roads?
18
lot of traffic and at the one in the beginning I was
19
told that it would probably start out with 50 trucks
20
per day.
21
Right.
My concern is that is not an
It's not a U.S. highway.
You're
Who's -- it might not be
But who's going to
Because that's going to get a
So that's a lot of
MR. COWAN:
At the beginning, that will be --
22
yes, there will be 50 trucks in and out.
23
up to a hundred, depending on how much capacity and how
24
quickly we move.
25
It could get
From our view, those -- the truck traffic
34
1
that we're going to have is much significantly less
2
than what we were told the truck traffic was when the
3
Fiero plant was up and running.
4
MS. CADD:
Right.
5
MR. COWAN:
Because they had continuous
24/7; we're not going to have that.
So
6
deliveries,
7
we're not going to have that constant pounding on the
8
trucks.
9
trucks will --we'll have a lot of empty trucks
And remember,
the trucks come one way,
We consolidate the garbage into larger trucks
10
leaving.
11
and they're able to leave.
12
the
So there's a process that we go through.
But
13
we believe that those trucks will not have the wear and
14
tear such as much larger trucks and industrial trucks,
15
carrying heavy metals.
16
know,
17
We're carrying refuse,
you
neighborhood garbage.
MS. CADD:
Okay.
Because my concern is,
18
okay,
19
down to Baldwin and your trucks,
20
they're going to be going north again
so you're coming north to south from the freeway
21
MR. COWAN:
22
MS. CADD:
once they're empty,
Right.
-- towards the freeways or to
23
wherever you drop your materials.
24
a lot of traffic.
25
all of our infrastructure is getting torn up and that
And I know Fiero had
But my concern about the roads was
35
1
hasn't had any work and you're going to be a good
2
neighbor,
3
going to be active.
4
the Oakland County or anybody addressed the wear and
5
tear on the roads?
you're going to be a good business, you're
6
MR. COWAN:
7
MS. CADD:
And my concern is for future, has
If
And I just wanted an answer for
8
that.
And then, with the incinerator,
9
no incinerator on the site?
MR. COWAN:
10
No,
it says there's
there will be no incinerator
11
operations.
12
Detroit incinerator, not the incinerator we would have
13
on site.
14
process with the MDEQ.
15
That reference that I made would be to the
And that would require a whole separate
MS. CADD:
Okay.
And maybe I'm out of line
16
when I ask.
But when they separated the property, the
17
Fiero plant,
Detroit Edison took over the energy plant
18
there and I think that is set up for incineration.
19
you guys have any plans to partner with DTE in the
20
future to make that one of your properties to use for
21
an incinerator?
22
23
MR. COWAN:
property.
No,
Do
that's Detroit Edison's
We've had no discussion with them --
24
MS. CADD:
25
MR. COWAN:
Okay.
-- about any activities on that
36
1
site.
MS. CADD:
2
And it says you're going to have
3
about 13 or 15 employees.
4
before you said you planned on employing about 30.
5
I'm sure that,
6
increase your employees?
as business grows,
MR. COWAN:
7
And I know at the meeting
Yeah.
Well,
you're going to
and I want to
8
explain that because I want to be consistent.
9
a statement before the City Council that the two
We made
10
facilities together would have approximately 30 new
11
employees.
12
facility and another 15 at a future date.
13
So
So about half will be with the first
And when we come before,
you know,
we'll have
14
to come to the Planning Department at some time, we
15
intend to have parking for those employees also
16
adjacent to that building.
17
38 acres,
18
site.
Clearly, we've got
there will never be a parking problem on this
19
MS. CADD:
20
questions I have at this time.
21
MR. COWAN:
Thank you, Commissioner.
22
Thank you.
To Mayor Waterman, please.
23
MAYOR WATERMAN:
Okay.
24
compatriots over here,
25
coming.
And that's all the
Thank you.
Yes, Mr. Cowan and your
this has been a long time
And I know you followed the process through,
37
1
very tenaciously adhered to all the guidelines.
I had just been installed as Mayor of the
2
3
City when you came and were about to start the process
4
going for the solid waste committee at Oakland County.
5
And I
know what an arduous process that was.
To answer,
6
I think the questions some of the
7
proposed -- and that's been a long time,
it's been over
8
a year now since we started that process and talked
9
about how Pontiac was going to be involved and what our
10
support was.
11
those who either don't remember so long ago or were not
12
involved in that,
13
answer some of the questions,
14
posed for you.
15
And so we may just review,
for some of
just some of the things that would
Number one,
I think,
that have been
in terms of the blight removal,
16
you know,
17
the City was certainly blight removal.
18
to be able to have a reuse for that Fiero plant,
19
is sitting there kind of vacant and fallow certainly is
20
a great aid toward blight removal in this community.
21
one of the things we said about doing in this
And certainly
And we have seen your site plans.
which
Certainly,
22
it corresponds with the things that we had discussed
23
with you when the City Council and I were involved in
24
some negotiations.
25
Also,
because of the fact that we realize
38
1
that the truck traffic, as you described,
2
some concern to the neighbors because of the wear and
3
tear of the roads,
4
with Council and we worked with you on this agreement
5
was is what was called a ''host agreement'',
6
there are royalties to be paid.
7
the new Council and my coming in,
8
talked about that because it was a consideration,
9
know,
10
would cause
one of the things we initially did
in which
And, based upon with
we sat with you and
you
this wear and tear on the roads that we would
have to repair.
11
And largely, because of that consideration,
12
we worked out with you -- the original host agreement
13
had been set by the emergency manager.
14
worked out an agreement to increase those host fees to
15
make an allowance for the fact that,
16
would be increased traffic and wear and tear.
17
host fee,
18
was,
19
substantial and that was what the allowances were made
20
and that was a consideration for allowing for the fare.
21
And that's revenue right to the City's budget
I
as I
recall now,
Council and I
you know,
there
And that
from what the original fee
think i t increased to 150 percent.
So that was
So --
22
in addition to the property taxes as you stated.
23
and also the fact,
24
property that's going to be controlled by DEQ, Michigan
25
State and all the things that you had asserted to in
the assurance that this is a
39
1
terms of having it cleaned up,
2
and making sure that there was no refuse contained on
3
the site,
4
controlled by the DEQ.
for 6:00 p.m.
those were all things that are strictly
And I
5
you know,
know that they moved that process,
6
after you've gotten approval from all the various
7
cities,
8
four,
9
been adhered to.
that the DEQ process has taken,
five,
six months,
I don't know,
So that has all
that I recall.
I think a couple of things that we may still
10
11
want to illuminate the public on is that you talked
12
about having this in a couple phases.
13
illuminate us on what those phases are as you go
14
through.
15
even
I
just want to
Not everything will start up the first time.
I think a lot of people are very interested
16
in the fact that you also will offer to the City -- and
17
this wasn't part of the original deal
18
drop-off recycling center, which will be an additional
19
benefit and this was not in the original agreement and
20
that you're offering that of your own volition.
21
but at that
So you talked about that as well as I think
22
somebody asked you about the jobs, you know, where were
23
there new businesses coming in.
24
is also important information for me,
25
Counsel and everybody else in town.
Workforce development
for everybody on
So you might want
40
1
to illuminate again, avail us of the kind of jobs that
2
will be available and those possibilities.
3
can talk about the phases and then also just, as people
4
will be looking for,
5
opportunities, in terms of workforce development and
6
employment there?
MR. COWAN:
7
But if you
opportunities to -- what are the
Mr. Chairman,
could we address
8
those issues now?
9
Governmental Affairs Director address those topics that
10
I'd like to have Mr. Munem, Rizzo's
the Mayor brought up.
MR. MUNEM:
11
Thank you.
Thank you.
Good evening.
12
name is Joseph Munem.
13
Affairs for Rizzo Environmental Services,
14
Elmridge, Sterling Heights, Michigan 48313.
15
My
I'm the Director of Governmental
6200
Good evening, Mr. Chairman, Commissioners and
16
Madam Mayor.
17
Road is a building that we intend -- yes,
18
building there,
19
And we intend to put a single-stream recycling facility
20
there.
21
The building that is closest to Baldwin
is a
that,
that
that would be a second phase.
Given the fact that we are not required to
22
seek any permitting from the MDEQ to have a
23
single-stream recycling facility and we are required to
24
do it for the transfer processing facility,
25
indicated right there by the pointer, we decided that
as
41
1
we want to proceed with that for -- the first reason,
2
we want to go with that first because that's going to
3
take significantly more time.
Also,
4
the recycling market remains a little
5
flat,
though we see improvements.
And as it improves,
6
we'll be able to get in and get the equipment in and
7
get that operating.
8
Services is actually not just a waste hauling company,
9
we're also very dedicated to recycling.
Because Rizzo Environmental
We own
10
Royal Oak Recycling, which is one of the largest
11
commercial recycling facilities in the midwest.
12
yes, we are very interested in having our own
13
single-stream facility but that is the second phase.
14
So
And yes, we made a commitment right from the
15
beginning that we are going to give priority to Pontiac
16
residents,
17
these facilities.
18
Madam Mayor?
19
20
in terms of hiring or working in both of
So does that answer your question,
MAYOR WATERMAN:
indeed.
It does,
indeed.
21
MR. COWAN:
22
MAYOR WATERMAN:
23
It does,
Thank you.
And that completes my
questions, Mr. Chair.
24
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
Thank you.
Thank you, Mayor.
42
1
To Commissioner Parlove, please.
2
MS.
PARLOVE:
Good evening.
Thank you,
A couple different
3
gentlemen, for coming tonight.
4
things:
5
available to people like yourselves, companies like
6
yourself and we need to certainly do the best we can
7
with what we have.
8
people that are coming to us.
9
so to speak, is a challenge, not every community wants
It's -- Pontiac has so much space that's
10
to have it.
11
needs to be done.
12
And we're-- we're welcoming to
And to take the garbage,
But at the same time, it's something that
Personally,
I will put as many recyclables in
13
my car as I can and I drive down to the South Oakland
14
Recovery Center.
15
be able to take my recycles within such close proximity
16
would be something I would thoroughly appreciate.
17
know this, they take things there that most other
18
places do not.
19
it be at that same degree or to that same extent that
20
South Oakland takes?
21
MR. COWAN:
And to have something in our city to
I do
If you're taking our recyclables, would
I believe we would be able to
22
take the normal,
23
permit for hazardous waste-type materials.
24
seeking a permit from the State and that's a
25
separate -- and I think, since Mr. Munem got up,
regular recycles.
We won't have a
We're not
I'm
43
1
going to further let him address that issue.
MR. MUNEM:
2
Thank you.
they'll be able
plastics,
things that you
3
to drop off paper,
4
typically would be able to drop off at a recycle
5
center.
6
that site.
There will not be hazardous waste dropoff at
I'm sorry.
Oh,
7
8
is,
9
facility,
corrugate,
Yeah,
well,
What was the other question?
actually,
just to clarify what this
it isn't -- this is a step up from a transfer
as far as the State of Michigan and the MDEQ
10
is concerned.
11
strictly for a transfer station,
12
as a processing plant, which means that we're obligated
13
to divert at least ten percent of what is dropped there
14
from the waste stream and recycle it.
15
So,
Our application with the State isn't
again,
our mission,
it's for what's known
the thing that we're
16
really dedicated to is diversion from the landfills.
17
So this plant is something that is going to take
18
significantly more,
19
out of the landfills.
20
commit to do it, per application,
21
obligated to do it.
22
MS.
in terms of recyclables and get it
PARLOVE:
So -- and-- and not only are we
Okay.
we are legally
So quickly,
regarding
23
things that you would take.
24
and,
25
going to be just kind of a basic recycling?
numbers 1 and 2.
For example,
plastics ls
Anything beyond that?
Is it
For the
44
1
record, would you take electronic components,
2
things of that nature; is it going to be a bit more -MR. MUNEM:
3
used COs,
We're-- I mean, to tell you the
4
truth, we haven't actually thought about everything
5
that we'll take at that facility.
6
like most community drop-off centers.
7
electronics don't show up on just a drop-off basis.
8
There's most communities that have electronic recycling
9
tend to have those on days where you have special
It will tend to be
And typically
10
containers to -- firms that specialize in taking out
11
the electronics.
12
But I mean, we're willing to work with the
13
City.
We intend on being good corporate citizens and
14
also making sure that we are diverting as much of your
15
waste stream away from landfills as humanly possible.
16
MS. PARLOVE:
17
as a conversation --
18
MR. MUNEM:
19
MS. PARLOVE:
20
21
Okay.
So if we can leave that
Yes, ma'am.
that would be appreciated.
Thank you.
The other thing that -- to be at that site
22
today is certainly a little bit disappointing, it's --
23
there's been some-- well, it's been unused for a long
24
time and it has seen better days.
25
To have a business there again and,
as we're
45
1
driving by as residents,
there's that fence that's been
2
there for a while that's brown,
3
material is,
4
obviously,
5
just continues do -- to sit there.
I don't know what the
it's providing some screening and,
that's not decaying,
it's something that
Is it possible that we can also get something
6
7
incorporated that's more of the landscape-type of
8
screening that's going to soften that look,
9
going to make it more enjoyable to look at for what
10
that's
goes on behind that area?
MR. COWAN:
11
Yes,
that is going to occur the
12
CEO of Rizzo Environmental Services, Chuck Rizzo was,
13
before he joined the family business,
14
landscaper.
15
facility and I'm not sure, Mayor, did you go on the
16
tour?
a professional
And if you have ever been to their
17
MAYOR WATERMAN:
18
MR. COWAN:
Yes,
I think she can attest,
even
19
though it may have been in the winter,
20
beautifully landscaped.
21
this facility.
22
you ever see a Rizzo truck on the road,
23
cleaned almost every day.
24
about the public appearance of their facilities and of
25
their trucks;
They,
the facility is
That will be replicated at
the Rizzos,
are meticulous.
If
those get
They are very meticulous
they believe that speaks volumes about
46
1
who they are and what they are.
So we're able to put the -- on Baldwin, the
2
3
obscuring requirement,
4
required under the ordinance.
5
that that's what was going to be there.
6
same time,
7
landscaping of the front of the facility,
8
It's not going to be what is there today.
So we could show you
But at the
we fully intend to have a full,
MS.
9
the obscuring fencing which is
PARLOVE:
Okay.
Great.
complete
especially.
And then there's
10
a note about the water,
11
sentence says WRC review and approval of a sanitary
12
main will be required.
13
bit more,
Can you go into that a little
do you know?
14
MR.
15
right person,
16
MS.
PARLOVE:
17
MR.
COWAN:
18
the sanitary main where the
COWAN:
I think Mr.
our engineer,
Burns would be the
to answer that question.
Thank you.
I'm sorry,
I can't answer every
question; that's why we brought the team.
19
MS.
PARLOVE:
20
MR.
BURNS:
You're doing great.
Hello,
I'm Rick Burns.
My
21
business address is local, 18 West Lawrence in Pontiac,
22
Michigan.
23
now.
24
trying to find a balance.
25
finaling out of all of those facilities by the end of
Yes,
those plans are under development right
We're working closely with trying to gain and
We're planning to have a
47
1
next week.
MS.
2
PARLOVE:
Okay.
If it's on that RACER or
3
under the RACER property,
4
for expense or does some of it ends up becoming
5
Pontiac's responsibility?
MR. BURNS:
6
is that your responsibility
Everything that's outside the
7
property will be taken on by Rizzo Environmental
8
Services for improvements.
MS.
9
10
PARLOVE:
Okay.
And is that main under
your property or is it in the road?
MR.
11
BURNS:
There's a main at Baldwin Road
12
that we'll tap into.
13
bulkhead by GM or RACER when they left the site.
14
need to be reconnected.
15
MS.
16
questions.
Some of the facilities had been
PARLOVE:
Okay.
They
I think those are my
Thank you.
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
Commissioner Payne, please.
19
MS.
PAYNE:
Thank you.
Good evening.
Again,
thank you
20
for your interest in Pontiac and most of the questions
21
that I have been answered already.
22
But-- let's see.
And would it be possible for you to clarify,
23
when you say ''storage'',
24
"trucks".
25
the trucks or --
I did see in the plans here
Just exactly what will be stored there,
just
48
MR. COWAN:
1
There will be trucks.
There will
2
be some associated equipment that's incidental to the
3
operations.
4
snowplow,
5
equipment.
6
these large roll-off containers which are picked up by
7
a special truck and they're lifted onto the back of the
8
truck bed.
And those are mostly used for commercial
9
operations,
a lot of industrial applications and also
They need -- they'll probably have a
you know,
for that on site,
some maintenance
But the majority will be what's called
10
for transfer of debris and demolition materials.
11
so that's what those would be,
12
that location.
MS.
13
14
PAYNE:
Okay.
stored empty,
on site at
And this is called your
''Phase 1''?
15
MR. COWAN:
Yes.
16
MS.
PAYNE:
So your Phase --
17
MR.
COWAN:
Well,
18
And
the Phase 1 is actually the
waste transfer facility and processing plant.
19
MS.
20
MR. COWAN:
That's Phase 1.
21
MS.
So what would be a timeline on
22
you;
23
phase?
24
25
PAYNE:
PAYNE:
Okay.
are you planning on completing that part of the
MR. COWAN:
Yeah,
the -- as was mentioned,
the northern -- the northern building will eventually
49
1
be a single-stream recycling facility,
2
mechanized.
It is the -- the machines that take the
3
recyclables,
such as plastics and metals,
4
know,
5
whatnot and it processes them,
6
the metal,
7
it then can be removed and taken to companies that deal
8
in recycled goods and who purchase them.
your tomato paste,
such as,
you
you know, metal jar and
crushes the glass,
crushes it and puts it into a bay,
So that,
9
it's heavily
it's fairly good.
takes
so that
If you ever see a
10
picture, bring it up on Google,
11
intense,
12
kind of works as a symphony, a recycling symphony,
13
you're done with it because everything's coordinated
14
and that would be technically fast.
it's pretty capital
it requires a lot of coordinated machinery,
15
it
when
But these what we referred with Rizzo now
16
becoming the largest waste hauler in Oakland County is
17
that they're getting increasing demand for the
18
roll-offs.
19
central location in the County,
20
And so this was a logical place and we know our trucks
21
will be intersecting and they'll be bringing materials
22
here from the roll-off containers.
23
the sense that those are going to have to be stored
24
overnight somewhere.
25
And so this,
MS.
PAYNE:
you know,
Okay.
Pontiac is a very
the County seat also.
So it just made all
So now a timeline of what,
50
1
with the completion of that whole process of what are
2
your expectation of that?
MR. COWAN:
3
4
I'm going to let Mr. Munem talk
about the second phase of the timeline.
5
MR. MUNEM:
Mr. Chairman, thank you.
6
The timeline, it -- we don't have a firm
7
timeline on the second phase, at this point.
This is
8
something that we would hope that we would be able to
9
commence within -- you know, during this year.
10
But, again, because of the extensive
11
permitting requirements that are required by MDEQ, fore
12
we had to go through every level of government, county,
13
local and state, our efforts have been devoted
14
singularly to the processing facility.
Once we're able to get going on that, then
15
16
we'll be able to focus on the single-stream facility.
17
And,
18
capital-intensive endeavor.
19
something -- this is really the direction of our
20
company -- of our company.
21
extensively
22
23
24
25
as Mr. Cowan has pointed out, it's a very
But, you know, this is
But we have been working
I mean, Mr. Chairman,
I think you remember I
was here probably 23 months ago.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
well, vividly.
Yes,
I do,
I remember quite
51
MR. MUNEM:
1
really,
And as do I.
every step,
And this has been
2
at,
3
ways for our to condense this timeline for this
4
facility.
5
last meeting on the processing facility that we have to
6
go through.
7
body this evening, we'll be able to proceed and,
8
hopefully, have that operating by the fall.
This really is,
MS.
9
you know,
hopefully,
the
If we obtain approvals by this honorable
PAYNE:
MR. COWAN:
10
that there was not a lot of
Okay.
The -- I want to -- it dawned on
11
me that we didn't answer the first part of the
12
question,
13
done.
14
have had the plans.
15
be the approval of the -- hopefully the Planning
16
Commission this evening and we'll get that up to them
17
immediately.
18
given their lull in the timeline, we're trying to
19
expedite it and hopefully in the fall we'll be in
20
operation of the prosecuting plant.
which is when is this facility going to be
We're a little bit at the mercy of MDEQ but they
I think the exclamation point will
We're a little bit at their mercy but
21
Rick.
22
MR. BURNS:
I think I can offer a little bit
23
more detail.
The Part 115 permit application is --
24
well,
25
application to the DEQ southeastern Michigan office on
it's been drawn out.
We submitted the initial
52
1
March 31st.
They have 30 days to review our
2
application, which is quite significant with the
3
environmental assessment reports and all the design
4
elements.
5
administrative completeness letter which is due this
6
week.
After 30 days,
they issue us an
7
MS. PAYNE:
Okay.
8
MR. BURNS:
After that, they have an
9
additional 120 days to complete their technical review
10
of our application.
Once that's done, they've approved
11
our construction permit and we hope to work
12
concurrently with the City to make the improvement or
13
the plans.
14
September, we're ready to go with the second phase of
15
the DEQ process and that's to obtain an operating
16
license, which is different from a construction permit.
17
With that operating license, we're able to begin
18
business.
So at the same time,
in August or
19
MS. PAYNE:
Okay.
20
MR. BURNS:
We expect that to occur
22
MS. PAYNE:
Okay.
23
MR. BURNS:
For the back building to be
21
24
25
September.
clear.
Great.
Thank you.
Okay.
MS. PAYNE:
Okay.
Great.
Thank you.
53
1
MR. BURNS:
You're welcome.
2
MS.
I appreciate your answer.
3
PAYNE:
One of
the other questions is pest control.
4
MR. COWAN:
What?
5
MS.
Pest control.
6
MR. COWAN:
Yes.
7
MS.
Is there anything in the plans
PAYNE:
PAYNE:
8
for the surrounding communities; do you do any of that
9
with your other sites?
10
And the reason I ask that question is because
11
I have had, well,
12
somewhere near one of your other facilities and they
13
said that that was some of the problem -- well,
14
problem that they had.
some friends that kind of that live
one
15
MR. COWAN:
We're talking about past roads.
16
MS.
PAYNE:
Right.
17
MR.
BURNS:
We're talking about past roads.
18
That's a very good question.
19
concerns is to factor in vermin control.
20
that completely.
21
transfer station is that the entire building is secured
22
along the sides,
23
the time.
24
trash on a daily basis, and limit storage to no more
25
than 12 hours is how that rodent control is limited.
One of our primary
115 addresses
And the way that it's addressed to a
the bay doors are open,
But to clean the facility,
there -- all
to get rid of the
54
1
MS.
PAYNE:
2
MR. BURNS:
Uh-huh.
Plus when people are going to be
3
working in there,
4
activity employed in the back building for sure are
5
going to be a deterrent to any kind of rodent
6
activities.
MS.
7
the 10 to 15 employees will be
PAYNE:
Okay.
8
question, of course,
9
other vacant sites here.
Thank you.
On the last
you're aware that we have some
And are there any future
10
plans to, perhaps, build a business that would somewhat
11
enhance the City a little bit?
12
MR. COWAN:
13
while to get us to first base.
14
know, Rizzo works collaboratively with a number of
15
communities, they have a facility in Sterling Heights
16
they have -- they operate another waste transfer
17
facility in Warren.
18
things go.
19
right thing for their business and for the community.
20
Well,
this has taken quite a
And -- but I think,
you
You know, we're going to see how
They're always interested in doing the
But I will tell you that, despite the fact
21
that the Mayor and City Council drove a very hard
22
bargain on Round 2, we have felt very welcome here by
23
the community and by the staff that they -- you know,
24
everybody has to do their job and they've done their
25
job and we've done our job.
But I think that,
you
55
1
know,
looking into the future,
2
possibility.
3
far -- we're becoming quite an original operation also
4
in the TriCounty area.
5
suggestion.
7
out there.
PAYNE:
So --but we that you for that
Okay.
Just thought I'd throw it
Thank you.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
8
9
But, you know, we'll have to see how
MS.
6
that will be a
Thank you,
Commissioner
Payne.
10
To Vice Chair Fegley, please.
11
MS.
12
FEGLEY:
I don't have any comments at
this time.
13
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Oh, okay.
Well,
I'd like
14
to welcome your team back because I feel like I've
15
gotten to know them intimately well at the time.
16
yes,
17
I'd like to take less than 45 seconds,
18
a reminder,
19
originally started at Fisher Fiero, as I recall,
20
the time directed it to the decommission and
21
Kennett Road Landfill to which this Board objected and
22
to which I then made a presentation to the EM at that
23
time.
24
grand opposition on that but that's the way that those
25
things work.
it has been a long and winding road.
And
You know,
just as kind of
and this isn't a negative, but this
And I think Mr. Manczak and I,
GM at
kind of, were in
56
But anyhow,
1
that,
and I think that,
you know,
at that point
2
in time,
the Kennett Road landfill was
3
zoned heavy industrial.
4
residential,
5
residential but it did need to go all the way to heavy
6
industrial.
7
point in time,
8
40 acres and the Kennett Road landfill was 80,
9
seemed to be way more than you needed.
Kennett Road was zoned
which we weren't going to build
and then I also think that,
So
you needed something around 30,
So I wanted to bring that up because,
10
at that
35,
which
you
11
know,
we want to make sure that you're settled here
12
and,
13
and the City has -- I
14
chance to talk about this.
15
footprint of vacant industrial sites in the country,
16
which means anywhere in the world.
I mean,
17
I think you've been through this process
kind of like whenever I have a
We have amongst the largest
So we -- we can't repopulate an industrial
18
site with residential or lighter use.
19
be a proper re-purposing, proper reutilization.
20
like to mention an issue with regards to roads,
21
that brings it up.
22
So this seems to
I'd
in fact
That, whether Rizzo is here or another heavy
23
industry,
24
going to repopulate.
25
neighbor here, we have a business plan that you've
it is going to be heavy industry and we are
So the point is that we have a
57
1
worked -- well,
I guess it would be fair to say you've
2
worked harder than us but we've been intimately
3
involved or committed.
4
from start to finish,
So what's the length of time
roughly speaking?
It's been 19 months.
5
MR. COWAN:
6
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Nineteen months.
7
anyhow,
and with regard to the parking,
8
agreement that,
9
that there's ample parking that's there.
you know,
I'm kind of in
for the number of employees
And with regard to pest control,
10
So
I can offer
11
you Sam, my attack cat, he can come over and help you
12
out,
13
problem.
14
because it was brought up,
15
rodents, pests or whatever are going to be coming into
16
and not be going out of, because of the nature of the
17
business.
which -- and I don't think it's going to be a
18
And,
in fact,
I guess I ' l l probably say,
But to conclude,
you know,
any varmints,
if you would,
I'd like you
19
to take this group through just the life of one truck,
20
coming in,
21
how they go out.
22
But the truck comes in,
23
consolidation point,
24
MR. COWAN:
25
kind of how that operation works and then
I think you've kind of touched on it.
they drop off,
it's a
right?
Right,
that's correct.
will enter the property off of Baldwin,
The truck
on Baldwin
58
1
Road, come in, drop the neighborhood refuse, whatever
2
refuse they have, into the facility and then that
3
truck, that regular normal garbage truck, will exit.
The trucks, there's larger trucks that,
4
I
5
nonrecyclable materials are consolidated upon and when
6
those trucks are full -- and all refuse has to be taken
7
off,
8
down and stored within the interior of the building; I
9
want to make sure people understand that.
the recyclables don't.
The recyclables are washed
But after
10
that, those will be loaded up but those are all cleaned
11
and washed down.
12
end of the day, as previously been mentioned, the end
13
of the workday.
14
site.
15
But the garbage has to leave by the
So that consolidated truck will go off
Most of the garbage, most of the refuse
16
trucks will go back to the Sterling Heights' facility
17
at the end of the evening, if I'm correct.
18
stay on site, if they're going to maybe some of the
19
Oakland County communities.
20
quite every last detail but that's, in general, what
21
will happen
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
MR. COWAN:
24
25
Some will
We haven't worked out
Okay.
-- at the facility in terms of
the trucks.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Gentlemen, do you want
59
1
to -The collection trucks really are
MR. MUNEM:
2
3
not going to be based here,
4
the Rizzo family is rather meticulous about the
5
operation and maintenance of their vehicles and Mayor
6
Waterman had an occasion to go and actually see just
7
how -- I mean on a Saturday Mr. Rizzo's father was
8
there and working on the trucks.
In fact,
9
as Mr. Cowan pointed out,
Mr. Rizzo will often say that he
10
always feels that he runs a poor second to his dad's
11
trucks.
12
this time a service facility on this site, will not be
13
stored here.
14
are here because they're going to be running just
15
strictly back and forth between this site and the
16
disposal sites.
Those trucks,
17
Now,
since we're not proposing at
it could be that the transfer trucks
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
Thank you.
I have
18
no further questions.
19
without further ado,
20
Hearing and -- and while we know you, Mr. Johnson,
21
please state your name and address for the record,
22
please.
MR.
23
This is a public hearing.
So
I'm going to open it for Public
JOHNSON:
Thank you very much.
24
course, Chuck Johnson here.
25
questions.
Of
I guess I got a couple
I want to indicate to Rizzo that I'm a
60
1
demolition contractor here in the City of Pontiac and
2
my question would be, will you be taking demolition
3
debris at the facility on Baldwin?
4
number one.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
5
That's question
And way the way,
for
6
whatever it's worth, we'll collect the questions and
7
then we'll answer at the end.
MR. JOHNSON:
8
9
So --
And the second question is, and
I don't know if your comment that you made as it
10
relates to the way the trucks will be coming in and out
11
of the City.
But if you -- if any of your gentlemen
12
didn't know,
you should try and find out how many of
13
your trucks were ticketed over the last few months
14
since Martin Luther King was reduced in weight.
I know for a fact, because I was on
15
16
Martin Luther King when the Oakland County weigh man
17
stopped me and he had about three or four Rizzo trucks
18
stopped.
19
know.
20
you're saying the route your trucks are going to travel
21
won't be on any other street but Baldwin or off I-75
22
so,
23
food for thought,
24
25
Whether they got tickets or not,
I don't
But you probably need to check and see because
you know,
you might want to check this out.
Just
so to speak.
The building where we'll be dumping at, if
you be -- if you are going to be taking demolition
61
1
debris,
how high is the inside of that building; you
2
know,
3
of the building that would allow for a large truck to
4
dump?
is it 30 feet,
40 feet,
how high is the interior
I also noticed the cans,
5
the roll-offs.
And
6
I'm familiar with all these different types of
7
equipment.
8
right along Baldwin Avenue there that you indicated
9
that the cans will come in,
And I noticed the roll-off cans are stored
they'll get dumped out and
10
then the can will be stored into a -- that certain spot
11
on the south side of that building.
12
ever get an opportunity to be washed out or cleaned out
13
at some point?
14
know what's in those cans until they get into the site
15
to get dumped out.
16
Will these cans
Because I know that you guys don't even
People dump in them and so --
So anyways,
the height of the building.
Will
17
you be taking demolition debris?
18
Because I'm hopeful that I ' l l be able to bring my trash
19
to your facility.
And good luck to you.
Thank you.
20
THE CHAIRPERSON:
21
Please state your name and address for the
22
23
Thank you, Mr.
Johnson.
record, please.
MS. NARVAEZ:
24
Longfellow.
25
GM has put up with it.
Elizabeth Narvaez,
48 West
My concern is the debris that's coming in
We've always had problems with
62
1
seagulls,
rats and things like that.
2
to bring in more vermin.
3
going to be cleaning it up.
4
pesticide control when it goes into the residential?
You may say that they're
But who is going to be in
I live in that neighborhood.
5
And this is going
6
in that neighborhood.
7
years.
8
dumping ground.
9
City, we're trying to relive again.
My family lives
We've been here for over 50
And Pontiac always seemed to be zoned as a
I mean, we're trying to beautify the
And I understand that you're
10
I mean,
you're big
these guys are big wigs and you've
11
hitters.
12
got a lot of money and a lot of influence.
13
mean,
14
mean, up and down,
15
where Kennedy Junior High is and there's massive holes,
16
I mean, because of the trucks going up and down.
17
the City, the residential,
But,
is my concern.
I
I
you go down Baldwin and you go to
And it's going to be a lot of wear and tear
18
on the roads, it is going to be a lot of vermin.
19
mean,
20
going to be there and it's not going away.
21
I
you folks can say whatever you want but it's
And,
you know, what is the contamination?
22
it going to smell?
Because of all this garbage,
23
going to smell.
24
Are we getting garbage from everybody else, out of
25
state?
Is
it's
Are we getting garbage from Canada?
We don't know.
Just this morning,
I went down
63
1
I-75, Rizzo Truck Number 813 was going down the highway
2
on I-75,
3
mean,
4
video of it so you folks can see it.
5
one thing but you do another.
flying,
garbage was flying right out of it.
if I had a camera phone,
But,
6
I would have taken a
So you may say
you know, what's going to happen to the
7
property values?
8
taxpayer.
9
businesses up and down and a lot of these businesses
10
probably weren't notified or they don't even realize
11
what's going on at the Rizzo plant there.
Are they going to go up?
I mean, my concern is, you know,
So I mean,
12
I
you know,
I'm a
there's
there's a lot of things
13
that need to be addressed.
14
contamination to the neighbor -- the neighboring areas.
15
We have the roads.
16
fixed.
17
road from you,
18
there for about two years now.
19
mentioned,
20
The City has never done anything and it's still there.
21
I mean,
And my concern is the
I mean, we can't even get our roads
right next to Tennyson,
right down the
there's a giant pothole that's been
Mary Pietila has just
I put a lot of complaints in to the City.
So what's going to happen when we get a giant
22
sinkhole in the middle of Baldwin?
23
have any money to fix its own roads,
24
that's my concern, basically, my concern.
25
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
The City doesn't
you know.
And
Thank you very much.
64
MS. NARVAEZ:
1
2
There's other places for them
to dump their stuff.
3
THE CHAIRPERSON:
4
MR. NEFF:
5
I'm going to jump right up in back
of you.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
6
7
Thank you.
Please state your name and
address for the record, please.
8
MR. NEFF:
9
THE CHAIRPERSON:
10
MR. NEFF:
Dennis Neff.
I'm sorry?
Dennis Neff,
N-E-F-F,
11
77 East Beverly.
My front yard faces this area.
12
mean,
13
dragging these empty dumpsters back and forth on a
14
Saturday morning at 9:00.
15
unacceptable, period, already.
16
business.
they haven't even started operations and they're
17
The noise level's
And they're not even in
And I agree with her, you know,
18
traffic.
19
the railroad,
20
out of there.
50 trucks a day?
the truck
Fisher Body was serviced by
they didn't have 50 trucks a day in and
It's a joke.
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR. DIXON:
Hi.
It's a garbage dump.
Thank you.
Larry Dixon.
I own
23
22 East Kennett Street, across the street from the
24
site.
25
I
And there was an issue -THE CHAIRPERSON:
Larry.
State your --
65
MR.
1
I'm sorry.
DIXON:
There's an issue.
It's going
2
Because, first of all,
3
to be a restaurant.
4
a garbage dump in the front yard.
5
also have a salvage business and I have roll-off trucks
6
and I have roll-off boxes and I know what they can do
7
to a road and how much stuff can come out of the back.
8
Even if they're tarped, they get loose on you.
9
that something needs to be done.
10
I own the property.
I'm not going to go in there with
The other part is I
I feel
I'm the front door to their property.
George
11
is the back door of their property.
12
closest people.
13
notified about anything to do with this.
14
of it.
15
you know,
16
mean, chances are it's probably already been decided,
17
you know,
18
We're on both ends of it.
was never
I only heard
I said,
somebody needs to say something here.
I
I don't know how this would.
But I know I really don't want a garbage dump
in front of my restaurant.
20
can say at the moment.
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR.
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
I
And when I got a letter in the mail,
19
24
We are the two
DIXON:
I mean, that's really all I
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Please state
your name and address for the record.
MS.
PIETILA:
My name is Mary Pietila.
I am
66
1
a resident in the City of Pontiac in District 3.
2
live at 195 West Kennett Road.
3
47450 Woodward.
I
4
I
My office is here,
spoke about this on numerous occasions,
5
both across the TV on a Thursday evening as well as
6
knocking on doors and passing out fliers to the
7
streets.
8
Kennett,
9
going to be -- and Cornell.
West Beverly, Tennyson, Matteson,
Hollywood,
East Beverly and the one next to that that's
My grandson, a resident of the district,
10
Granted,
it was in
11
I did this all over a weekend.
12
August because we wanted to bring the attention and
13
that last
14
year that we did this.
15
numerous,
thousands of homes,
16
numbers.
It was an open discussion.
17
office here.
18
phone.
19
explained to them there was going to be a Public
20
Hearing here on that Thursday.
21
As far as the roll-offs,
22
are there.
23
no,
I take that back,
that was May of last
Ms. Millan did a robocall to
residential phone
I came up to an
They had conversations with people on the
They explained to them what i t was.
Yes,
and
yes,
there is, Ms.
They
We had nobody show up.
the roll-off dumpsters
Parlove,
there are slats
24
in the fencing because, when the snow melted,
25
and I asked to have addressed.
I called
I didn't want to see
67
1
the dumpsters -- or the roll-offs.
2
The roll-offs, by the way, you guys, are what
3
we use when we do our City-wide cleanup; those are what
4
roll-offs are.
When -- when this first came to us,
5
it came
6
to us under the direction of Mayor Zukowski.
7
Randy Carter and I went door-to-door and talked to
8
residents.
9
district.
I went to my
He went to his district.
We had an opportunity for residents to come
10
down here and to voice their opinion.
11
any, did.
12
Very few,
if
But they have gone through, Rizzo has gotten
13
the vote of each and every one of you elected officials
14
from the 9th Council as well as the 8th Council.
15
you have two different councils that have said yes.
So
16
It's going to be an asset to this community.
17
There are not going to be all that many trucks running
18
down the roads when you think about it.
19
what we had with GM; they were going.
20
house in 1992.
21
the time Fisher Body wasn't there.
22
trucks running 24/7.
23
and there was a lot of weight on those roads.
24
does not weigh as much as a car.
25
talking one car, we're talking about trailers of cars.
Just compare
I moved in my
Yes, we were slowed down on Fiero at
But we still had
And there were a lot of trucks
I mean,
Trash
and we're not
68
And I
1
know,
Mr.
Thomas,
I am talking,
so I'm
2
going to close it out.
3
District 3 has not had any residents come to me to call
4
my phone.
5
is forwarded to my cell phone.
6
why I missed any calls.
7
office phone that I have not heard because it
8
automatically comes to my cell phone,
9
to City Hall.
And,
So I think you got my message.
as I explained earlier, my office phone
So there is no reason
There is no voicemail on my
I don't answer long distance numbers that I
10
11
don't recognize.
12
business.
So I
13
to speak.
Please have a good day.
But when it's City Hall,
that's City
thank you for your time and allowing me
THE CHAIRPERSON:
14
15
and that comes up
Thank you very much.
Thank
you.
16
Any further comments or questions?
17
I'm going to close Public Hearing and then
18
we're going to answer the questions.
19
you
Sabo,
can
will you --
20
MR.
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR.
23
MR. COWAN:
24
MR.
25
So Mr.
from Mr.
SABO:
SABO:
SABO:
Johnson,
Yeah,
I have them.
-- guide us?
Mr. Cowan,
are you ready?
Sure.
All right.
First question was
will you take demolition debris at
69
1
the site?
MR. COWAN:
2
At this time, we are not planning
3
on taking what we call any ''third-party demolition
4
debris.''
5
responsible for and have contractual relationships,
6
maybe something we do in the future but, at the present
7
time, we don't have anything in place for that.
8
just want to get opened, get our -- you know,
9
basic operation going.
We will be taking debris that we are
MR. SABO:
10
Okay.
get the
And you may or may not know
11
this:
12
Martin Luther King Junior Drive?
How many of the Rizzo trucks were ticketed on
13
14
We
MR. COWAN:
We don't know.
Maybe Mr. Munem
MR. MUNEM:
I have daily e-mails, whenever we
recalls.
15
16
receive an overweight ticket.
Under Michigan law,
17
there's something known as the frost laws and there is
18
a period of time from when the -- it starts to thaw
19
out.
20
becomes further and further out, where the -- the
21
the weight on trucks,
22
know, we have to be more careful because the feeling
23
is -- and I'm sure there are road engineers who know
24
more about this than I do -- that while the thaw is
25
occurring,
And it just feels like every year that that
that basically reduces and,
you
that an overweight truck will do more to
70
1
tear the road up.
So we, during the frost -- during the period
2
3
of the frost law, we do receive more overweight
4
tickets,
5
communities that we go through.
6
something that is particular to Rizzo Environmental
7
Services.
8
and Waste Management and Republic and just about
9
everybody who hauls is going through the same thing.
10
not just in Pontiac but in many of the
However,
this is not
I guarantee you that your incumbent hauler
In fact,
I was at the -- I was in Kalamazoo
11
yesterday for the Michigan Recycling Coalition
12
Conference and ran into quite a few people who were
13
talking about how many overweight tickets.
14
speak to how many but I --you know,
15
going to come up here tonight and dispute the fact that
16
we haven't had some.
17
least two come out of the City of Pontiac.
18
And,
again,
In fact,
So I can't
I'm certainly not
I think I have seen at
we go out of our way to make sure
19
that we're in compliance with all State codes because,
20
believe me,
21
they're very costly.
22
those overweight tickets are not cheap,
MR. SABO:
All right,
Third question was
23
answered with the first question,
24
demo debris.
25
cans be cleaned or washed at the site on the south side
which is,
if you take
His fourth question, will the roll-off
71
1
of the building?
MR. COWAN:
2
They will be cleaned.
I'm not
3
sure if it will happen on the south side of the
4
building but they will be cleaned from time to time,
5
which is a standard protocol that we have.
MR. SABO:
6
7
forgive me,
Okay.
Next question from
Ms. Narvaez, is it?
8
MS. NARVAEZ:
9
MR. SABO:
Narvaez,
yes.
Who will be responsible for vermin
10
control in the neighborhoods?
11
MR. COWAN:
Well, we're responsible for our
12
site; we take that responsibility very seriously.
13
There are protocols and rules and regulations
14
promulgated by the MDEQ I do want to elect that we will
15
follow and,
16
aware of, whether they're by neighbors or the City,
17
we're going to correct them.
18
if there are problems,
that we're made
But I hope you know that there are these
19
facilities similar to ours, waste transfer and
20
processing facilities,
21
they're in Troy,
in Warren,
22
nearby.
the one we operate, Southfield and
23
here in Pontiac.
24
25
Warren,
throughout Oakland County;
I -- you know,
in Oakland County and
if there was massive problems
about rodents and other issues at those facilities,
you
72
I think each one
1
would have heard about them by now.
2
of those operators work very diligently.
3
with what we're dealing with, which is the County's
4
garbage and the garbage that we pick up.
5
it's very important to know this is not a dump.
6
that was probably said just as a generalization.
7
absolutely not a dump,
But I think
I know
It is
it is a transfer facility.
All of the refuse must be removed by the end
8
9
We recognize
of the business day.
That, we would get in a lot of
10
trouble for,
if we don't do it.
11
the site; that is when your rodents come is at night
12
and with garbage.
13
So if they come, they're going to be passing through
14
because there's going to be nothing there for them.
The garbage isn't going to be there.
MR. MUNEM:
15
None of it is left on
If I may.
Particularly into
16
vermin control, we are experienced operators of a
17
transfer facility.
18
of Warren to operate their transfer facility.
19
certain that,
20
Warren who are ultimately responsible for that transfer
21
facility,
22
way to make sure that that site is clean and vermin
23
free.
24
Sterling Heights where nearly 300 waste-hauling trucks
25
are parked every night.
We are under contract with the City
And I'm
if you contact the people in the City of
that will let you know that we go out of our
I work at our main facility on Elm Ridge Road in
Rodent issues are not
73
1
something that's -- I mean,
I have never seen one there
2
and the City of Sterling Heights, which I live in the
3
City of Sterling Heights and they're very aggressive
4
about rodent infestations, would be all over us if that
5
was a problem.
We also have facilities in Canton Township,
6
7
in Romulus,
8
Township.
9
because we're, actually, very meticulous about making
10
in the City of Royal Oak,
This is not an issue at any of these sites
sure that this doesn't go on.
11
THE CHAIRPERSON:
12
MR. SABO:
Okay.
All right.
Thank you.
I'm going to ask two
13
at a time.
14
road and what will the smell be like?
15
in White Lake
Will there be a lot of wear and tear on the
MR. COWAN:
Well,
the wear and tear and the
16
road issue and the repair of the roads,
I want to
17
clarify one thing:
18
are contributing through property taxes without a tax
19
abatement so we're going to take the full hit plus the
20
tipping fees,
21
City to do any repairs.
22
Rizzo trucks,
In addition to the money that we
which will be the funds available to the
like all other trucks,
23
particularly garbage trucks,
24
of money to the State for fees and taxes;
25
your Act 51 monies.
pay a significant amount
that goes to
Act 51 monies do come to the City
74
1
of Pontiac for road repair.
So we believe more so over and above what
2
3
other businesses already do here, we're going to
4
contribute the funding to do any of those necessary
5
repairs that will affect Baldwin Road, which has truck
6
traffic also that will not be from our facility.
7
think we're going over and above.
8
recognized.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
And I hope that's
Please state your name and
10
address for the record, please.
11
MR. JORDAN:
Hi.
My name is Alfred Jordan.
12
I'm the Detroit Municipal Affairs Manager,
13
Director from the City of Detroit, address the
14
6200 Elmridge,
15
talk very briefly about the cleanup.
16
But I
Sterling Heights, 48313.
formerly DPW
Just wanted to
First of all, my experience with a transfer
17
station, the Southfield transfer station, which was
18
operated by the City and capacity of over 3,000 tons
19
per day, moved out, no problems, that which would be
20
the same with this facility, wash the floors,
21
floors washed down daily and also deodorized.
22
you know,
23
just say that experience goes down to operating a
24
garbage truck and using the facilities and cleaning the
25
facilities.
tipping
So I
just based on my experience -- and let me
The same experience that I've had there
75
1
will be applied here at the -- at the Pontiac facility.
2
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you very much.
3
MR. COWAN:
and just a reference on the
So
4
odor control.
We have a protocol that we follow with
5
the chemical deodorizing and the treatment that is
6
used.
7
regulations and we're going to follow that protocol so
8
we're going to do everything possible to minimize any
9
odors.
We're required to do that under State
I think we should also note that the facility
10
11
is as far back as we could get it we have all kind of
12
possible buildings we could have used but we tried to
13
pick the one that was going to be left that was
14
farthest away in the back of the property and as far
15
away as reasonably we could get it from the
16
neighborhood to the north.
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
MR. SABO:
Thank you.
All right.
Thank you.
Are we -- are you
19
getting garbage from Canada and what will happen to
20
property value?
MR. COWAN:
21
No, we do not have any
any of the garbage from Canada.
What is
22
property
23
coming here is refuse which is picked up by Rizzo in
24
the communities that it works in.
25
respect to property values,
And also,
with
I have a little bit of
76
1
experience with this.
I was the mayor of Royal Oak for eight years.
2
was also on the Planning Commission.
About property
3
I
4
values,
5
significant investments and you take blighted property
6
and turn it into productive property, everybody, both
7
residential neighbors,
8
businesses.
I can safely say this:
Anytime you have
succeed and also the neighboring
I'm very familiar with the Royal Oak
9
10
Recycling Plant that has been in operation for over 25
11
years and is now owned by the Rizzo company.
12
mayor when they did expansion and things of that
13
nature.
14
around there -- and there are houses, not hundreds of
15
feet away, right on top,
16
are seeing new residential construction right in that
17
area,
18
construction nearby.
19
I was the
That neighborhood now that is immediately
right across the street.
single-family homes.
We've had condo
If your property is properly managed and run
20
by a very -- by good companies, such as Rizzo,
21
have -- you will see better days to come and an
22
increase in property values and not a decrease.
23
We
you will
Blight and unused property and under-utilized
24
property creates a decrease in property values and
25
we're hoping to be a leader in that corridor on
77
1
Baldwin Road in leading back to researching and, if I
2
could -- I have shared this with the Counsel.
3
believe what you're doing here in Pontiac with the
4
reuse of industrial plants is not a national story,
5
it's an international story; this is a positive thing
6
for Oakland County and the State of Michigan, which the
7
avenue that you've been proceeding along to try and
8
have the reuse of these old sites, the old
9
General Motors and other sites.
10
the strategy that you've chosen.
11
THE CHAIRPERSON:
12
MR. MUNEM:
I
So I applaud you for
Thank you.
Thank you.
And just to add on, in terms of
13
property values, there are homes almost immediately
14
adjacent to Royal Oak Recyc'l-i~ng where there are trucks
15
coming in daily, in and out, that are being sold in
16
excess of a quarter million dollars.
17
And another thing, a little closer, if you're
18
familiar with the Eagle Valley Landfill on Lapeer Road
19
down the street from The Palace of Auburn Hills, just
20
immediately cross the street in the High Hill
21
subdivision, there are homes that are approaching
22
$1 million.
23
is a far more intensive use, in terms of disposing of
24
waste than a transfer station.
25
And I would submit to you that a landfill
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
Thank you.
78
MR.
1
2
question left.
3
sinkholes?
All right.
If they're on our property,
we're
going to repair them.
6
MR.
7
THE CHAIRPERSON:
SABO:
Those are the only questions.
Okay.
8
We've had public hearing.
9
Questions have been answered.
10
This is the only
What will happen if there are giant
MR. COWAN:
4
5
SABO:
ado,
We've had questions.
We've had questions.
And so, without further
I'm going to ask for a motion, please.
11
MAYOR WATERMAN:
12
THE CHAIRPERSON:
13
MAYOR WATERMAN:
May I make a comment.
Yes, please.
Okay.
Hearing the
14
discussion and hearing some of the comments,
15
want to make one additional comment and question.
16
know the -- this is a wrong time to consider this but I
17
know there's a weight scale on site that wasn't working
18
at the time.
19
where will these trucks actually be weighed?
20
interested in that because our royalties are based upon
21
tonnage so I want to make sure we get -Right.
23
being circled right there,
24
the --
25
MR.
just
I
What is the situation regarding that and
MR. COWAN:
22
I
SABO:
North?
Oh,
absolutely.
I'm very
That
I think that would be on
79
MR. COWAN:
1
Is it northern line?
So when the
2
trucks come in, they will just make a pit stop right
3
there and be weighed and,
4
City agreement,
5
there that will be able to accurately weight all the
6
tonnage so that we can live up to the terms of our
7
agreement.
under the terms of our whole
there will be an operational scale
8
MAYOR WATERMAN:
9
MR. COWAN:
Okay.
But I don't believe that that's
10
been installed yet because we don't have a building
11
permit.
12
MAYOR WATERMAN:
Right.
Okay.
And the
13
roll-off containers also are part of the tonnage, even
14
though they're not necessarily part of the normal
15
neighborhood waste collection?
16
MR. COWAN:
17
part of the tonnage?
18
MR. BURNS:
Yes.
19
MR. COWAN:
Yes,
20
MAYOR WATERMAN:
21
MR. COWAN:
Rick, do you want to -- is that
that is part of the tonnage.
Okay.
Specifically
Whatever's there that's in
22
containers is part of it.
23
MAYOR WATERMAN:
Okay.
The last comment I
24
want to make is, you know,
I, too, when we started
25
investigating this wanted to make sure that this was a
80
1
facility that,
2
community that I would want to have around the corner
3
from me,
4
did take a tour of a similar facility in Troy, which is
5
a half a mile off Coolidge from Somerset Mall.
too.
you know,
if we brought this to the
So we did and the City Councilman, we
So Somerset Mall is mostly recognized as one
6
7
of the ritzier,
8
Michigan.
9
you know,
if not the ritziest mall in southeast
So the fact that this could be maintained,
just that distance from Somerset Mall was
10
proof to me that it could be done in a residential
11
setting -- or in an urban setting.
But just as proof of that
12
and,
you know,
13
you can correct me if I overstate this -- but the DEQ,
14
which is the Department of -- that controls the
15
environmental quality,
16
with that initially, they continue to have oversight
17
over the maintenance.
18
have to do on a regular basis with strict controls.
19
fact,
20
maintained.
21
level, also talk about what those levels of control are
22
for the DEQ even after you get all these permits and
23
get open.
24
25
even though you had to permit
And there is reporting that you
In
they can shut you down if those aren't
You may want to,
MR. COWAN:
Right.
who deals with those issues,
just for people's comfort
I might ask Mr. Manczak,
to come up and address
81
I will tell you this and he'll tell you in
1
them.
2
detail,
3
reporting requirements but there's inspections that
4
occur.
5
the facility with the MDEQ oversight.
that not only is there continuing oversight of
So if you want to address the relationship of
MR. MANCZAK:
6
Sure.
Richard Manczak, Counsel
7
for Rizzo Environmental Services with Varnum,
8
business address is 39500 High Pointe Boulevard in
9
Nevi, Michigan.
10
Yes,
LLP.
My
the MDEQ maintains oversight
11
responsibility for all disposal facilities and transfer
12
and processing facilities and that involves regular
13
monthly inspections of the facility and as required.
14
So if there are any complaints that are made by
15
neighbors,
16
will send someone out to the site to do an inspection
17
and make sure that we're complying.
18
site down for failure to comply with the operating
19
requirements.
20
a nuisance.
21
competitors, anyone,
to the MDEQ,
the MDEQ
They can shut the
They can shut the site down for creating
And so,
you know,
they will be out there at
22
least on a monthly basis, making sure that we're doing
23
things properly.
24
are not good citizens, that the -- the residents and
25
officials of the City of Pontiac will let us know and
And I'm sure that,
you know,
if we
82
1
we'll let the MDEQ know and we would take care of it,
2
that route.
I don't think that that will be at all a
3
4
likely occurrence because we know how to operate these
5
things properly and we'll make sure that we abide by
6
the law.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
7
Thank you.
You know,
I'm
8
going to take a -- just a second to make a comment with
9
regard to not only this site but all of our industrial
10
sites.
11
the owners of the largest footprint of unused
12
industrial sites in the world.
13
having this vacant property.
14
general industry; that means that it's -- we're not
15
going to wake up -- we can't rezone this to residential
16
and a softer utilization.
17
And Pontiac, as Mr. Cowan pointed out, we are
And no one gains by
This is M-2.
It's
So it -- so we have to find the best
18
utilization for this parcel.
19
repopulate so, whether it's that or stamping or
20
manufacturing or other heavy industry,
21
have trucks coming and going in there.
22
We benefit by having it
it is going to
So, again, we are not going to -- we can't
23
rezone this to residential.
24
best re-purposing,
25
business partner to help repopulate,
So we need to find the
reutilization,
find the best
increase the tax
83
1
revenue in this -- in this City, which we need
2
desperately, enhanced tax revenue goes a long way
3
toward repairing a lot of things in this City that need
4
to be repaired.
So I want to -- want that to be known,
5
6
this isn't an arbitrary decision to put heavy
7
utilization on this property.
8
already -- when I -- I live in the back -- I
9
went right back to my boyhood home that,
10
boy,
11
house,
that
This property is
the Pontiac Motor Foundry,
live -- I
when I was a
400 yards behind my
ran 24 hours a day.
And so it's -- it's a different zoning now--
12
13
or excuse me -- it's a different utilization now.
14
we have to repopulate parcels, we have to find proper
15
re-purposing and I think that we have a good partner
16
here to help us do the right thing and to move Pontiac
17
forward.
18
or questions from my fellow commissioners?
19
20
So that's my comment.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Well,
But
Any further comments
two.
One is did we
ever formally close the public hearing?
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Yes.
Okay.
And then the other --
23
well, my other comment is that, while we do have large
24
sites that were previously heavy industrial, we have to
25
be aware of the movement toward a more
84
And that I'm not sure that
1
information-based society.
2
we can continue to look through the -- just through the
3
lens of looking for other industrial, heavy industrial,
4
other-- let's say other-- other sites that present
5
some -- some challenges,
6
lot of work done to mitigate them,
7
get locked into the pattern of going right back to
8
where we were.
9
even though there will be a
I hope that we don't
I hope that we look at some other uses for
10
these sites in the future and,
11
use, we do that with an idea of leaving our options
12
open for other more innovative site uses.
13
time, we do have to be practical and be aware that
14
there are going to be certain items that we're going to
15
have to allow.
16
as we grant any one site
At the same
I'm going to tell you I -- listening to not
17
only the comments here,
18
first came to the City Council,
19
Mrs.
20
real effort to get out into the community and engage
21
what was going on.
22
the comments earlier when this
I also have to applaud
Pietila, also Mr. Carter on what I saw as being a
The -- as I said, Rizzo has,
time and time
23
again presented a plan that I think meets or, probably
24
even in some cases,
25
a very difficult operation.
exceeds the letter of the law with
They have a plan.
They
85
1
2
have evidence.
I,
too, went on one of the tours to look at
3
the Rizzo plant and had a chance to look at their
4
operations and saw that the operations were -- I think,
5
given -- given the constraints, given the direction and
6
the other items that they're operating within, they're
7
doing-- they're doing an excellent job.
8
fact that we are in the heart of Oakland County and we
9
do have, by virtue of location, we also have some
10
11
But just the
potential to do some other things.
We
we remain mindful of what we go -- what
So I just wanted
12
we do in the future as we go forward.
13
to throw that out to say that, yes, these are heavy
14
industrial sites.
15
those sites that can -- can -- we have to be careful on
16
the type of development that occurs.
17
just heavy industrial and always going to be heavy
18
industrial,
19
Those are my comments.
There are some things that are in
But to say that
I hope that we look beyond just that.
20
THE CHAIRPERSON:
21
MAYOR WATERMAN:
Mayor.
I know the hour is getting
22
late but I think one correction, Mr. Chair, and this
23
may be news to you.
24
the largest inventory of unused industrial sites.
25
are no longer that inventory.
But Pontiac at one time was -- had
In fact,
We
with the sale
86
1
of two of the major GM RACER Trust properties last
2
October to IRG, both Centerpoint Central, a 1.2 million
3
square feet and Centerpoint West of 800,000 square
4
feet,
those were major sales.
People are coming to Pontiac and looking for
5
6
sites now and hearing this new message that we're
7
taking out in terms of business in Pontiac.
8
longer hold that record,
9
there was one industry that came here and wanted a
10
factory of 100,000 square feet and we may have had
11
those before but we're hard put to try to find that,
12
aren't we, Mr. Sabo?
13
MR. SABO:
14
MAYOR WATERMAN:
15
straight.
16
image.
In fact,
Yes, we are.
So just to set the record
And I'm just kind of loyal to the Pontiac
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
18
I'm happy to say.
So we no
Okay.
Any further comments
or questions before we take a motion?
MR. SABO:
19
Mr. Chairman,
just a
20
clarification.
21
exception and site planning for an outdoor storage yard
22
(major).
23
The proposal before you is for special
Part 115 of the State Environmental
24
Protection Act gives Oakland County Solid Waste
25
Commission the authority for the approval of the waste
87
1
transfer.
That is not what you're voting on tonight.
2
THE CHAIRPERSON:
3
May we have a -- may we have a motion,
4
Very good.
please.
MS. FEGLEY:
5
I move to propose site plan and
6
special exception permit for 888 Baldwin Road,
7
PF-15-27,
8
LLC,
9
exception permit standards from Section 6.303 and
Prime Design Systems Inc., Baldwin,
Pontiac,
for outdoor storage yard (major), based on special
10
subject to compliance with the following conditions:
11
And then the compliance with Section 4.408 for trash
12
receptacle screening closure modification of the
13
minimum of parking spaces required in accordance with
14
section 4.304 and reduce the required parking from 92
15
spaces to 30 spaces, compliance with all building
16
construction codes,
17
fire codes and City permitting requirements,
18
compliance with all City of Pontiac business licensing
19
requirements.
20
21
energy -- engineering standard,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
MS. CADD:
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
May we have a
second, please?
22
24
Thank you.
in
I'll second it.
We have a move and a
second.
Any further comments or questions before we
88
1
go to roll call?
roll call, please.
2
Mr. Sabo,
3
MR.
SABO:
4
MS.
FEGLEY:
5
MR. SABO:
Commissioner Cadd?
6
MS. CADD:
Yes.
7
MR. SABO:
Mayor Waterman?
8
MAYOR WATERMAN:
9
MR. SABO:
Commissioner Fegley?
Yes.
Commissioner Northcross?
10
MR. NORTHCROSS:
11
MR. SABO:
12
MS. PARLOVE:
13
MR. SABO:
14
MS. PAYNE:
15
MR. SABO:
16
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
MR. SABO:
18
Yes.
Commissioner Payne?
Yes.
Chairman Thomas?
Yes.
Motion carries unanimously for
outdoor storage.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
20
SEVERAL PEOPLE:
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Congratulations.
Thank you.
Let us know how we can
help.
23
MR. MUNEM:
24
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
Yes.
Commissioner Par love?
19
22
Yes.
Thank you very much.
public hearing we shall go.
Okay.
We have another
This is the Site Plan
89
1
Review/Special Exception Permit PF-14-34 at
2
360 Franklin Road and Mr. Bowdell will present.
MR. BOWDELL:
3
And I apologize,
I noticed I did not put a site plan
4
too,
5
in your packet and I forget to put one in PowerPoint as
6
well but I ' l l explain what is going on here.
7
plan review and special exception permit for
8
360 Franklin Road zoning a C-1.
9
The request is for a -- classified as a mobile food
10
11
to everybody.
Thank you.
The site
This is the site here.
vehicle vendor.
The applicant is looking to have a barbecue
12
pit set up in the right-of-way here on the sidewalk in
13
front of Franklin Road Market -- the Franklin Market.
14
This is pictures of the proposal.
15
Zoning C-1 existing land use is
16
Franklin Market and they're looking to get a barbecue
17
pit outside.
18
mobile food vehicle vendor must comply with.
19
won't -- I ' l l only go over the ones that are issues.
20
These are just the provisions that any
I
The proposal is proposed end of right-of-way.
21
Technically it's supposed to be on private property or
22
they have to obtain engineering approval of a
23
right-of-way permit.
24
25
They're also-- they may be located in what
we classify as the clear vision area and,
which we
90
1
don't really want any structures in for people turning
2
on -- on Franklin Road or South Boulevard so they can
3
see traffic.
4
and the City Engineer can waive that.
5
recommended that maybe the applicant move his facility
6
slightly out of that clear vision area.
7
Hours of operation,
The Planning Commission can waive that
It is
none were proposed,
8
however the ordinance requires the operation be from
9
10:00 a.m. -- hours that will be 10:00 a.m. until
10
10:00 p.m. Sundays through Thursday and 10:00 a.m.
11
until 11:00 p.m. on Friday and Saturday, unless
12
otherwise approved by the Planning Commission.
13
Planning Commission may approve other types of hours,
14
if they -- if they seek to be.
Meets all these other standards,
15
So the
a formal
16
food vehicle vendor.
No tree survey is required,
17
exterior lighting, no landscaping or parking is
18
required.
19
Planning Commission as it is required that,
20
within 150 feet from a residential dwelling,
21
to get a special exception permit; and that is why
22
they're here before you.
no
These are -- it does come before the
if they're
they have
But essentially for the special exception
23
24
permit,
the use,
it should be harmonious and in
25
accordance with the general principles and objectives
91
1
of the Comprehensive Master Plan; meets that standard
2
as the Master Plan identifies the parcel as
3
Entrepreneurial,
Industrial and Commercial.
Two, be designed and constructed, operated
4
5
and maintained so as to be harmonious and appropriate
6
in appearance,
7
may or may not be meet the standard, as I said
8
currently,
9
clear-vision area.
10
13
14
15
16
17
it's located in the right-of-way of that
Perhaps if the applicant moves,
it
would meet that standard.
Three,
11
12
the existing appearance or character; it
the area;
not change the essential character of
it appears to meet that standard.
Four,
not be hazardous or disturbing to
existing or future uses; appears to meet that standard.
Five, be adequately served by a public
facility; meets the standard.
Six,
It's on South Boulevard.
not involve the use of activity process
18
and materials and equipment or conditions of operation
19
that will be detrimental to any person, property or
20
general welfare; meets the standard.
21
Commission,
22
of operation.
23
The Planning
as I stated, may impose conditions on hours
Seven, maintain all proposed structures,
24
equipment or materials in a readily accessible manner
25
for police and fire protection; meets that standard.
92
The analysis,
1
as I stated,
they come before
2
you because it is 150 feet from a residential dwelling.
3
It appears to meet the standard from 6.303 of the
4
zoning ordinance.
5
facility is in that clear-vision area.
The largest concern is that the
The Planning Department recommends that the
6
7
applicant reposition the operation.
8
Planning Commission can approve it at that location,
9
they -- if they feel the need to.
10
However,
the
if
So the recommendation is to approve it,
11
subject to -- and permit hours of operation from the
12
Planning Commission to decide that,
13
relocating the operation out of that clear-vision area,
14
obtaining a right-of-way permit from the Engineering
15
Department, compliance with all municipal code
16
standards for that proposed use and obtain a vendor tag
17
from the City of Pontiac Building Department.
18
19
Pretty straightforward,
subject to
that is my report.
The applicant is here as well.
20
THE CHAIRPERSON:
21
Will the petitioner please come forward.
Thank you, Mr. Bowdell.
22
know you've probably heard us say this a few times.
23
Please state your name and address,
24
please.
25
MR.
INGRAM:
Gary Ingram,
I
for the record,
20212 Mada Avenue,
93
1
Southfield, Michigan 48037.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
2
3
Welcome.
4
your case.
5
modify?
You've heard Mr. Bowdell's presentation of
And what would you like to change or
MR. INGRAM:
6
Good evening, Gary.
Nothing.
He's exactly right
I'm now partially
7
about me being in the right-of-way.
8
on the sidewalk and I have a space that I can move up a
9
couple feet and be out of the right-of-way.
I'm
10
willing to do whatever needs to be done to abide by the
11
laws of Pontiac.
12
straightforward and kind in helping me with the process
13
with this.
14
or anything that you'd like to know from me.
15
16
And that's about it.
He's been very
And I'll see if anybody has any questions
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
Very good.
Thank
you.
17
MR. INGRAM:
Thank you.
18
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Without further ado,
I'm
19
going to go right down to Commissioner Northcross,
20
please.
21
MR. NORTHCROSS:
22
MR. INGRAM:
23
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Hello, Mr.
Ingram.
Hi, how are you?
Just a question.
And as I
24
understand it, there is currently vehicles parking
25
between the sidewalk and the --
94
MR.
1
INGRAM:
Yes,
there's a -- at the market
2
there,
there's a slab of asphalt which is used for
3
parking and which is a part of his lot.
4
on this side,
5
the north side.
6
the front also.
like,
He has a lot
I don't know what you'd call that,
Then there's a parking strip there in
Was that
he was that --
7
MR. NORTHCROSS:
8
was that something that -- that was
9
that came before the Planning -- that area that is --
10
THE CHAIRPERSON:
11
MR.
12
Mr. Chairman,
SABO:
No,
that would --
No.
Mr.
Northcross.
I can answer that.
It is a
13
makeshift operation of that facility.
14
really be utilizing that right-of-way.
15
building is on the property line and that's just how
16
that business has evolved over time.
17
MR.
NORTHCROSS:
Nobody should
But the
And the -- the request is to
18
move the actual grilling facility into where the
19
vehicles are now parking?
20
MR.
INGRAM:
The vehicles don't actually park
21
where I will be moving to.
22
it.
23
right there,
24
down a little bit,
25
enter from about where the arrow is and from there to
You have a
yes.
like,
But that's the beginning of
there's an area that's light
That's where I am and then come up,
there's a ramp there where cars
95
1
the end of the pathway is where they actually park.
MR. BOWDELL:
2
The -- if I may interject,
the
3
recommendation -- the recommendation -- and the
4
Planning Commission can approve the location right here
5
if they would like to.
6
move the -- not move the operation further towards the
7
right-of-way but essentially move it a little further
8
away from the corner --
9
MR.
10
INGRAM:
The recommendation is to not
Okay.
MR. BOWDELL:
where traffic may be coming
11
in or obstructing view for traffic on pedestrians.
12
they would recommend to move it a little further this
13
way or down here; that would be the recommendation.
14
However,
15
current location here.
the Planning Commission can approve it at its
16
17
MR. NORTHCROSS:
And will it be covering the
sidewalk?
18
MR.
19
MR. NORTHCROSS:
20
MR. INGRAM:
INGRAM:
No.
When -- so you --
I'll be maybe six inches on the
21
sidewalk from the corner where these
22
there?
23
out of the pathway of the sidewalk.
24
MR. NORTHCROSS:
25
So
see right
If I move up and where that van is,
see from the strip.
Yeah,
Oh, okay.
I can be
I was trying to
I guess the concern -- a
96
1
couple concerns.
2
further over to,
3
time.
4
now.
Yeah, and I agree with moving it
you know,
just give a little more
Because Franklin Road is in horrible shape right
5
MR.
INGRAM:
Yeah.
6
MR. NORTHCROSS:
And a lot of times,
7
trying to make the-- as you're driving,
8
to make the light at Franklin Road, dodging the
9
potholes and then, boom,
you're
you're trying
you're into the intersection
10
and you're turning so it would be good to have that
11
little additional -MR.
13
MR. NORTHCROSS:
14
MR.
15
MR. NORTHCROSS:
16
INGRAM:
I'm not obstructing any --
12
INGRAM:
Yeah.
of any roads.
No, my thought is the clear
vision portion of it.
17
MR.
INGRAM:
Oh, okay, yes.
18
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Yeah,
yeah,
not obstruction.
19
And then I was just trying to remember the -- the
20
sidewalk there.
21
that area and they pull in and they pull out.
I know there's cars that do park in
22
MR.
INGRAM:
23
MR. NORTHCROSS:
I don't know,
Yeah.
24
issue,
25
have that parking there,
So,
I mean,
if that's not an
I was just surprised that we do
you know,
that section.
97
1
The -- the movement of the actual grilling facilities
2
further down,
3
well.
4
that with the way that the cars are parking up on that
5
area and if that falls in line with,
6
practice.
I think,
is an excellent idea and works
I was just trying to,
in my head,
also reconcile
you know,
standard
Is this something that was originally agreed
7
8
to and is going along,
9
of the time between the sidewalk and the -- and the
10
conformance?
street
11
MR. BOWDELL:
12
MR.
NORTHCROSS:
MR.
BOWDELL:
13
I -- I know most
Yeah.
we normally don't have
parking.
14
Commissioner Northcross,
15
James here mentioned,
16
don't know,
17
was approved at the time.
18
from the sidewalk to the street,
19
whether this was approved at one time or not,
20
existing currently.
21
Mr.
22
as
we don't really know how
we
technically, when this was put in,
if it
You are correct, generally,
it would be grass.
So
it's
And it has nothing to do with
Ingram's application.
However,
people do-- I've noticed people do
23
park there.
24
the location is appropriate,
25
situated in the right-of-way at the proper location to
So if -- if the Planning Commission feels
just to make sure it's
98
1
not obstruct vehicles or pedestrian traffic.
2
MR. NORTHCROSS:
3
THE CHAIRPERSON:
4
Okay.
No further questions.
Thank you.
To Mayor
Waterman, please.
5
MAYOR WATERMAN:
6
MR. INGRAM:
7
MAYOR WATERMAN:
8
that you intend to --
9
MR. INGRAM:
Hi, Mr. Ingram.
Hi.
How are you?
What is the food product
Ribs --
10
MAYOR WATERMAN:
11
MR. INGRAM:
12
MAYOR WATERMAN:
13
MR. INGRAM:
14
MAYOR WATERMAN:
15
MR. INGRAM:
16
MAYOR WATERMAN:
make there?
and Polish sausage.
Do you got good sauce?
Yes.
It's all in the sauce.
I got some in the car now.
No.
Okay.
And there was
17
another comment I had to make but I'll hear the rest of
18
the discussion first, Mr. Chair.
19
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
20
To Commissioner Cadd, please.
21
MS. CADD:
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
Commissioner Parlove.
24
MS. PARLOVE:
25
MR. INGRAM:
I have no comments.
No?
Okay.
Good evening, Mr.
Good evening.
Ingram.
How are you?
99
1
MS. PARLOVE:
2
MR.
3
MS. PARLOVE:
4
think
5
up,
Fine.
Good.
How about you?
Thank you.
Good.
I'm-- when I
when I hear a food truck, as this was written
I think of something that's on wheels and mobile.
6
MR.
INGRAM:
7
MS.
PARLOVE:
8
Right.
But what you're actually
looking for is an approval of what you have there?
MR.
9
INGRAM:
MS. PARLOVE:
10
I
INGRAM:
I'm good.
Vendor space, yes.
Okay.
When you're doing your
11
food prep, before you're putting it on the grill, where
12
does that all happen for you?
13
MR. BURNS:
Mainly at my house.
I have
14
approval from the Health Department also.
15
insured the pit,
16
and that's about it.
17
into a location maybe in there three months or so.
18
I've looked at-- there's an old barbecue restaurant
19
that was right there on Woodward and South Boulevard
20
this is just a temporary.
like everything, an insurance program,
21
MS.
PARLOVE:
22
MR.
INGRAM:
23
24
25
And I
And I have plans to also move
Oh, great.
I plan to move into an actual
dwelling.
MS. PARLOVE:
Great.
Because what I see for
you is you're going to have more business than you can
100
1
handle once M-1 opens up.
INGRAM:
2
MR.
3
MS. PARLOVE:
4
MR.
5
MS. PARLOVE:
6
INGRAM:
8
MS.
PARLOVE:
So good luck.
11
MR.
Yes.
This is all very good.
Well,
I
Thank you so much.
I'm always behind the
INGRAM:
Thank you.
And you guys are
welcome to come by for samples.
13
MS. PARLOVE:
14
THE CHAIRPERSON:
15
MS. PAYNE:
16
MR.
17
MS. PAYNE:
Thank you.
Commissioner Payne, please.
Good evening.
INGRAM:
Thank you.
And thank you for your interest
in Pontiac.
19
MR.
INGRAM:
20
MS.
PAYNE:
21
You do?
entrepreneur, especially when it comes to good food.
10
18
And I cater also.
completely support your endeavor.
MR.
12
Oh.
INGRAM:
7
9
Yes.
Thank you.
Just one of the questions I had
was operation hours.
I will be there from 11:00 to no
22
MR.
INGRAM:
23
later than 6:00, daily.
24
MS.
PAYNE:
25
MR.
INGRAM:
From 11:00 a.m.?
Yes, ma'am.
101
1
MS. PAYNE:
2
MR. INGRAM:
3
MS. PAYNE:
4
question.
MR.
INGRAM:
6
MS.
PAYNE:
MR. INGRAM:
9
MS. PAYNE:
10
MR. INGRAM:
11
MS. PAYNE:
And I guess this is her
Yes.
Okay.
And so storage plans, like
They're iced in a cooler.
Iced cooler?
Yes.
Okay.
Okay.
So parking,
everyone comes right in that area?
MR.
13
14
Okay.
when your meats -- where are they stored?
8
12
Yes.
Now, are you in partnership with the store?
5
7
Until 6:00p.m.?
there,
INGRAM:
Yeah.
See that little slot
right there?
15
MS. PAYNE:
16
MR.
INGRAM:
Yes.
And they go forward or you can
17
park right on the front of the street.
18
allowed there.
19
MS. PAYNE:
20
MR.
21
22
They go in and out?
Yes.
And there's also a parking
lot at the end there.
MS. PAYNE:
23
area for you?
24
MR.
25
INGRAM:
Parking is
INGRAM:
Have you found that to be a safe
Well,
the neighborhood is not
actually the greatest but I don't have any problems.
I
102
1
mean,
I have full support of Roy and his son Chris
2
which own the store.
3
I'm a personable guy so--
And I don't have any problems.
So traffic-wise,
4
MS.
PAYNE:
5
MR.
INGRAM:
6
MS.
PAYNE:
7
MR.
INGRAM:
8
MS.
PAYNE:
9
THE CHAIRPERSON:
It's fine.
Okay.
Yep.
Okay.
That's all I have.
Thank you.
10
To Vice Chair Fegley, please.
11
MS.
FEGLEY:
it's --
My only comment,
I drive past
12
here every day, back and forth to work and I've seen
13
you set up.
14
against that building.
15
any line of sight with people turning or coming around
16
that corner because the building is set off of
17
Franklin.
When the -- everything's set up right
I really don't think you're in
18
MR.
INGRAM:
No,
19
MS.
FEGLEY:
So I don't know how the Planning
I agree, yes.
20
Commissioners feel but I don't feel like you need to
21
get pushed forward towards that entrance of that
22
business because there is such a high-traffic of people
23
coming in and out and it kind of gets everyone pushed
24
together?
25
MR.
INGRAM:
No,
I don't --
103
MS.
1
FEGLEY:
So I don't have any problem with
2
it coming closer to Franklin as long as it's up against
3
the building and not pushed up against the sidewalk
4
like you have shown here.
I thank you.
5
MR. INGRAM:
Okay.
6
MS. FEGLEY:
Because I know right now you
7
have it shown where people are driving in and out.
8
hate for you to get hit or someone standing there
9
ordering getting hit.
10
I'd
I wouldn't mind you pushing it
more towards Franklin so that your customers --
11
MR. INGRAM:
That's fine.
12
MS. FEGLEY:
I don't know how anybody else
13
feels.
14
just pull in.
I can do that.
I just know people drive in there fast and they
I would hate for someone to get hit.
15
MR. INGRAM:
Yes.
16
MS. FEGLEY:
Because it's a high traffic
MR.
People are trying to get out of
17
18
area.
INGRAM:
19
the way so they do tend to speed up in there a little
20
bit faster than they actually should.
21
MS. FEGLEY:
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
first ask a question of Mr. Bowdell.
24
exception permit,
25
10:00 to 10:00 and then 10:00 to 11:00.
That's my only comment.
Section K,
Thank you.
And let me
Under the special
it outlines hours from
104
But I guess, Mr.
1
2
MR.
INGRAM:
Yeah, after 6:00,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
I'm with you.
MR.
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
INGRAM:
Yeah.
All right.
MR.
11
I'll be gone.
INGRAM:
No,
I won't be there.
12
THE CHAIRPERSON:
13
MR.
14
THE CHAIRPERSON:
All right.
16
MR.
temporary.
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
19
I was a little
concerned about that 11:00 anyhow.
10
15
That
sounds okay.
7
9
I'm out of
there.
5
6
you're saying you
only want to be there up until --
3
4
Ingram,
INGRAM:
At dusk,
Okay.
Yeah.
So this is a
temporary
INGRAM:
Yes,
-- operation until you go
up to -MR.
INGRAM:
Yeah,
until I'm-- there's two
20
buildings, there's an -- actually the old Andre's,
21
which is on Huron; I'm looking at that building.
22
the old barbecue restaurant that was right there on
23
South Boulevard and Woodward.
24
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
MR.
INGRAM:
Yes.
And Woodward?
And
105
THE CHAIRPERSON:
1
2
here to deal with this.
3
being 18 months out?
MR.
4
5
10
Oh, okay.
Okay.
All
MR. INGRAM:
I'll be in a location.
I'll
still be here a couple months after that, just to
redirect my customers and everything.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
All right.
I mean, I like it.
I mean, that
I -- we -- we --
12
sounds -- yeah,
13
this group was instrumental in revising and putting
14
together a mobile food ordinance and coding.
15
MR. INGRAM:
16
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
Okay.
MR. INGRAM:
19
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
We're happy to have you in
Pontiac.
21
MR. INGRAM:
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
MR. INGRAM:
24
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
So we're happy to have a
good operator.
18
20
I
No, maybe four or five months at
right.
11
)'
But, I mean, do you see that
THE CHAIRPERSON:
8
9
And not to-- we're
the most.
6
7
INGRAM:
Okay.
Thank you.
Good to be here.
And I wish you good luck.
Thank you.
Thank you.
This is a
public hearing so I'm going to open up to public
106
1
I've seen this guy before.
hearing.
MR.
2
JOHNSON:
Chuck Johnson,
But
21 North Paddock
I don't think we can afford to allow our
3
Street.
4
stomachs to go between what's right and what's wrong in
5
this particular issue.
6
Commissioners will all approve him on a temporary basis
7
so that he can get hisself in a position to move into a
8
more solid building or whatever.
But I'm hopeful that the
But this whole piece here, and I can remember
9
10
it, James,
11
owner of the building wanted to do some remodeling, an
12
addition and there was so many requirements that he was
13
supposed to meet and he didn't meet them.
14
never followed up on any of it.
15
when this building came under fire,
Now,
when the
But the City
technically, technically, that store
16
shouldn't even be allowed to be open, technically.
17
Because,
18
Mr. Manczak and Cowan over there indicated,
19
supposed to be grass, that's not supposed to be asphalt
20
and there's no parking up there,
21
owner of that store paved that and he didn't get a
22
permit.
23
just like Mr. Bowdell and just like
that's
technically.
But the
It don't have drains and so on and so forth.
I'm just putting that up there on the table
24
for you to understand that,
25
man here.
with no reflection on this
I'm hopeful that he'll be able to get and
107
1
cook his meat and do whatever he's got to do there.
2
But somebody needs to look at some more of these issues
3
where businesses are not in compliance in this City.
4
And it hurts a person like this gentleman,
5
cases, that wants to do something in this town but yet
6
where he wants to do it at is not even in compliance
7
itself.
So Madam Mayor,
8
9
in some
I think this is an issue that
would come across your table and, hopefully,
it won't
10
be the taste out of your stomach or your mouth on the
11
food part of it.
12
Technically, he was supposed to have put that entrance
13
on the side on the west end of that building.
14
went down probably 12 years ago when he wanted to
15
remodel that property.
16
But this needs to be addressed.
This all
And you might go back in the records and find
17
that, Mr. Sabo.
But he was supposed to do to put that
18
front entrance on the far west side of that building.
19
Thank you very much.
20
THE CHAIRPERSON:
21
Any further public comments?
22
I'm going to close the public hearing.
23
yes,
24
grandfathered in,
25
indeed,
That you.
And
Code Enforcement was done and kind of
I guess.
But any further comments or questions before
108
1
we go to seek a motion?
MS. FEGLEY:
2
3
.I
How far is the right-of-way, the
clear-site distance?
4
MR. BOWDELL:
Technically -- and this
5
building doesn't even comply --
6
MS. FEGLEY:
7
MR. BOWDELL:
Right.
-- it's a 25-foot site
8
clearance.
And the only zoning district that doesn't
9
need to meet those standards is the downtown zoning
10
district where all the buildings are right up to the
11
street.
12
compliance with that standard.
13
from the corner this way.
14
15
But technically, even this building's not in
MS. FEGLEY:
For the corner of the building
or the corner of the property line?
16
MR. BOWDELL:
17
MS. FEGLEY:
18
It's 25 foot measured
Corner of the property line.
Okay.
So 25 feet would put us
almost in the middle of the building?
19
MR. BOWDELL:
20
MS.
FEGLEY:
Correct.
So,
However, as you --
if we do a recommendation
21
and we allow him to be in that right-of-way, how would
22
we word that for the recommendation?
23
one is compliance with Section 2.54
24
25
MR. BOWDELL:
Because number
I would say because the
Planning Commission with can modify that.
109
1
MS.
FEGLEY:
2
MR. BOWDELL:
Yeah.
I would say to allow in the
3
actual motion to say to allow him at his proposed
4
location.
5
MS.
6
MR. BOWDELL:
7
MS.
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
FEGLEY:
FEGLEY:
Okay.
And remove Condition 1.
Okay.
Okay.
Any further comments
or questions before we go to seek a motion?
10
MR. NORTHCROSS:
I would hope we would follow
11
up,
too, with the parking situation there.
12
can make a note to someone to follow up with that
13
parking situation.
14
about it, my concern --
15
And if we
I guess, as I sat here and thought
And I think Commissioner Fegley,
you
16
mentioned that cars do bump up on that area very close
17
and it could be a catastrophe just waiting to happen of
18
a person trying to purchase and, at the same time,
19
car trying to park in an area they shouldn't be
20
parking.
21
MR.
22
here.
23
parking,
24
the --
25
INGRAM:
a
Let me explain something to you
Behind where the entrance ramp is for the actual
I'm not where the-- where the cars come into
THE CHAIRPERSON:
According to that one photo
110
1
right there?
MR.
2
INGRAM:
Right there.
See, that's where
3
the cars enter and go forward.
4
near there; they're on the sidewalk and in there.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
5
6
cars.
8
I just have a concern about
It's not so much your
MR. INGRAM:
7
My people are nowhere
Right,
I understand what you're
saying.
MR. NORTHCROSS:
9
10
MR.
INGRAM:
11
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Yeah.
Yeah,
I got you.
Yeah.
Just -- and people
12
coming in and out of the door, even there's cars
13
parking right in front of the door.
14
MR. INGRAM:
That's right.
15
MR. NORTHCROSS:
And people walking in and
16
out and back.
And I know this bothered me and just
17
looking at it out of the corner of my eye and had a
18
chance to let those ideas kind of solidify and say, oh,
19
yeah but, you know,
20
another
your operation's another --
21
MR.
INGRAM:
Beast.
22
MR. NORTHCROSS:
23
MR. BURNS:
24
THE CHAIRPERSON:
25
Mayor?
Yeah.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
111
MAYOR WATERMAN:
1
A question I have but I'll
2
make a comment first,
3
things that were grandfathered in for this particular
4
structure are certainly -- we can't go back and undo
5
things that happened 12 years ago but we'd just like to
6
bring your attention to this Planning Commission does
7
follow -- does have Master Plan and Zoning Ordinances
8
and that we do follow them and follow up so we are
9
attempting to move forward with a little clear sight
10
than what might have happened when this building was
11
originally modified.
12
in that we talked about the
But my question to -- I don't know if the
13
Planning Commission knows this but just to remind you,
14
when this mobile vendor ordinance was passed last year,
15
City Council did pass it and the allotted 12 initial
16
mobile vendor licenses and I'd like to know, do you
17
know offhand how many of those have already been spoken
18
for?
19
of how many more might be required,
20
up,
21
mobile vendor licenses,
22
are in that process?
23
Because they're
we just wanted to get an idea
with summer corning
with a number of other people might want to have
MR. BOWDELL:
I
just want to know,
where we
I believe we have five issues
24
currently and the -- it's -- it's seasonal.
25
the license runs from April 15th through December 31st.
Obviously,
112
1
But I believe we have currently five licenses.
2
then those -- those people that are licensed the prior
3
year can renew their license from April 1st to
4
April 15th -MR. INGRAM:
5
6
okay.
I'm sorry.
December -- from April -- oh,
I misunderstood you.
7
MR. BOWDELL:
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
And
Yeah.
Okay.
Any further comments
or questions before we take a motion?
10
Okay.
Can we have a motion, please.
11
MS. FEGLEY:
To approve the proposed Special
12
Exception Permit/Site Plan Review PF-14-34 for
13
Gary Ingram Barbecue, to allow a mobile food vehicle
14
vendor in the right-of-way in front of 360 Franklin
15
Road and permit hours of operation from 10:00 a.m.
16
until 7:00 p.m., subject to the following conditions:
17
Compliance with the municipal code standard from
18
Section 26-1035, compliance with City of Pontiac
19
Business License requirements -- do I have to do Number
20
2 also; does he need to obtain a right-of-way
21
22
23
24
25
MR. BOWDELL:
He would need to obtain a
right-of-way permit.
MS. FEGLEY:
Okay.
And obtain a right-of-way
permit from the Engineering Department.
MR. INGRAM:
Okay.
113
2
Do we have a second,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
1
please?
3
MR. NORTHCROSS:
4
MS. PARLOVE:
5
THE CHAIRPERSON:
6
I'm sorry.
7
second.
8
to roll call?
I second.
Second.
We have a -- excuse me.
This evening we have a motion, we have a
Any further comments or questions before we go
Mr. Sabo, roll call, please -- Mr. Bowdell.
9
10
MR. BOWDELL:
11
MS. FEGLEY:
12
MR. BOWDELL:
13
MR. NORTHCROSS:
14
MR. BOWDELL:
Commissioner Parlove?
15
MS. PARLOVE:
Yes.
16
MR. BOWDELL:
Commissioner Payne?
17
MS. PAYNE:
18
MR. BOWDELL:
19
MS. CADD:
20
MR. BOWDELL:
21
MAYOR WATERMAN:
22
MR. BOWDELL:
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
24
MR. BOWDELL:
25
Very good.
Commissioner Fegley?
Yes.
Commissioner Northcross?
Yes.
Yes.
Commissioner Cadd?
Yes.
Mayor Waterman.
Yes.
And Chair Thomas.
Yes.
Motion carries unanimously.
114
1
MR. BURNS:
2
THE CHAIRPERSON:
3
MR. NORTHCROSS:
4
THE CHAIRPERSON:
5
God bless you all.
Thank you.
Thank you, sir.
And we probably can't get
by for our free samples until Saturday.
MR.
6
INGRAM:
7
back.
8
to, come Monday.
Whenever you guys want to come
My kid is graduating Saturday so,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
MR. BURNS:
10
11
Thank you.
you very much.
12
if you want
Monday?
And we're closed Sunday.
Thank
Have a blessed evening.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
To our final
application for the evening,
13
petition of the evening
14
PF-15-19.
15
But it is a site plan review of 2000 Centerpoint Drive
16
and Mr. Sabo will present.
17
I'm remised.
MR. SABO:
This is not a public hearing.
Correct.
Thanks.
Mr. Chairman,
18
Commissioners, this is the site here, 2000 Centerpoint,
19
former GM engineering facility, about a million square
20
feet total.
Proposal is to occupy the northern 150,000
21
square feet,
site plan review or use change at the site
22
to M-2 Industrial zoning, constructing 150,000 square
23
foot battery manufacturing facility at 2000 Centerpoint
24
and an enclosed truck loading dock and an enclosed
25
storage tank containment building.
115
This is the site here,
1
north to the top of
2
the drawing,
South Boulevard here and Ring Road.
The
3
new construction in this area here, a truck dock,
4
relocation of the utility lines and the containment
5
building,
the tank storage building there.
And this is the elevations and then the floor
6
7
plan for the building office here and then the
8
operations on the floor and this is what it looks like
9
when it's really raining heavy outside.
10
M-2 Industrial zoning,
11
office and engineering facility.
12
Industrial Commercial and Green,
13
supports this.
14
former vacant GM
It's Entrepreneurial
2014 Master Plan
Adaptive reuse of that former GM Design
15
Center building, constructing space for battery
16
manufacturing,
17
portion of the west parking lot area, a new truck and
18
loading dock area,
19
building,
20
curb cuts and a parking entrance along South Boulevard
21
these are all compliant on the bulk area standards to
22
an existing building.
23
24
25
removal and reconstruction of the
a new tank building,
enclosed tank
relocation of the underground utilities, new
Tree survey,
it's all landscaped completely
utilized site.
Exterior lighting was already approved at
116
1
another time.
Trash receptacle is all happening in the
2
interior of the building.
Landscaping, this is all complying as well.
3
4
They will just need to update the portion of the
5
landscaping that they're removing and changing.
6
just need to provide a plan, showing that to us as
7
well.
8
9
They
The rest is all compliant.
Parking is more than compliant as well.
proposed battery manufacturing facility's combatable
10
permitted use in the M-2 zone district,
11
adaptive reuse of former GM building.
It has been
12
unutilized for a long period of time.
It will add
13
employment opportunities in the City and increase
14
potential for related economic development.
15
The
it's an
The only ordinance relation issue is the
16
landscape plan update and Nowak and Fraus has mentioned
17
they will be providing that.
18
somewhat concern with the South Boulevard curb cut.
19
They would rather not see that but he'll -- the
20
engineer will need to approve that, actually if the
21
Planning Commission provides the approval.
22
And engineering is a
Recommendation here is to approve the site
23
plan for 2000 Centerpoint, subject to those conditions;
24
4.403 landscape approval from the City Engineer for the
25
curb cut and construction codes, building codes and
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1
compliance with City Business Licensing.
That's my report.
2
3
4
The applicant is here as
well.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you, Mr. Sabo.
May
5
the applicant please come forward and please state your
6
name and address for the record, please.
7
MR. LITTLE:
Hello.
My name is John Little.
8
I'm the construction manager for the facility, my
9
address is 158 Elma Drive, Elyria, Ohio.
10
MR. TULIKANGAS:
Hello.
My name is
I'm with Nowak and Fraus, engineers.
11
Paul Tulikangas.
12
We're right at the across the street here at address is
13
46777 Woodward Avenue.
14
MR. KOETTING:
Good evening, Petitioners.
My
I reside at 929 Hemlock in
15
name is William Koetting.
16
Rochester, Michigan 48207.
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
MR. KOETTING:
19
THE CHAIRPERSON:
20
MR. KOETTING:
Did you say Ketting?
Koetting is my last name?
How do you spell it?
K-0-E-T-T-I-N-G.
I'm the
So I'm
21
Engineering Director for Energy Power Systems.
22
responsible for most of the activities going on today.
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
24
MR. KOETTING:
25
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Okay.
And -Well, you heard Mr. Sabo's
118
1
presentation of your case.
2
or change or modify or are you satisfied with the
3
presentation?
MR. KOETTING:
4
What would you like to add
You know, one thing I'd like
5
to say is that -- and I said this a couple times
6
before.
7
part of energy storage and batteries my entire life,
8
almost 22 years.
9
this is I really -- this is our first opportunity to
This is a great opportunity for us.
I've been
And what's real interesting about
10
become profitable for alternative energy and it's a
11
real science of Mr.
12
technologies together.
13
Darr and Mr. Townsend to bring
We have a development facility and we're
14
going into manufacturing of a clean air matrix
15
technology that will make stop-start micro hybrids
16
affordable for us to buy.
17
pay a premium.
18
You're not going to have to
So, in saying that,
I think the big part is
19
bringing the technology back to Pontiac and the
20
opportunity to put in place a clean manufacturing
21
environment while establishing the alternative energy.
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
Without further ado,
24
25
Very good.
then,
Thank you.
I'm going to go to
my fellow commissioners for comments and questions.
To Commissioner Northcross, please.
119
1
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Thank you.
2
Sounds exciting.
3
the lithium/ion type battery setups?
4
5
Thank you.
This is going to be like what,
MR. KOETTING:
one of
There are a combination of
technologies --
6
MR. NORTHCROSS:
7
MR. KOETTING:
Okay,
-- that are going to be in
8
this building.
The research side,
for those of you who
9
are familiar with the polymer technology granted
10
roughly eight or nine years ago.
We're trying to
11
establish lithium technology so our pack center will be
12
in this facility.
13
development,
14
our matrix, which is a crossover technology for my
15
for hybrids stop-start and also for those of you who
16
are interested,
17
opportunities to offset loads with the grid with energy
18
storage and possibly lengthening the lives of power
19
generation, utilizing better -- better being able to
20
utilize solar panels and solar power,
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR. KOETTING:
And some of the advanced
along with manufacturing in the plant and
we look at grid applications.
23
organization.
24
technology.
25
that he couldn't be.
So
if necessary.
Excellent.
So we are a profit-driven type
We create value propositions by the
I wish Mr.
Darr was here and we apologize
120
But the problem is that we want to be able to
1
2
enable technology,
3
create the best things out there and sell a lot of them
4
and bring the costs down.
5
hasn't been there and this is our first opportunity to
6
make that happen.
7
about it.
8
9
it's always that we've been able to
So,
But,
in fact,
this just
long answer, but I get excited
MR. NORTHCROSS:
No,
exciting area and one apropos,
no, and it is an
I mean,
this is
10
something that's happening right now that we really
11
need to stabilize a lot of our energy consumption and
12
the ability to make the energy and bridge that gap of
13
what happens at night,
for instance.
14
MR. KOETTING:
15
MR. NORTHCROSS:
Yeah.
Okay.
I guess the only --
16
only concern -- and I see it hasn't gone through to the
17
building -- or it hasn't began through to the Fire
18
Department and the Water Resource Commissioners.
19
guess the appropriate types of barriers and containment
20
facilities and also fire suppression things will be
21
there if we are into some of those metals that, when
22
they go off,
23
But I
they go off.
MR. KOETTING:
Yeah.
I don't know if you're
24
familiar with energy conversion devices.
25
Mr. -- Mr. Ovshinsky,
God bless
the metal hydride story.
I
121
1
worked for them for eleven years so I'm quite familiar
2
with hydrofluoric metals.
3
process.
This is a much more stable
It's not even in that league, again.
And, you know, we've been meeting with
4
5
different staff and we've invited them to our facility
6
in Troy.
7
processes and how we're doing things.
8
we've been able to answer most people's questions, of
9
course, codes for handling any type of metals will be
So we're familiarizing them with our
10
met and, you know,
11
owners.
12
And also,
I'm pretty sure
this is our group working with the
I don't know if it's obvious but
13
we've gone through extensive means to bring on good
14
consulting for our -- when we established our air
15
permit and things like that we have the best of the
16
best.
17
have -- the gentleman, our primary consultant, this is
18
the 151st facility that he's established so we've
19
really spared no cost in making sure we're doing this
20
right.
We've been up to the DEQ already, people that
21
MR. NORTHCROSS:
22
THE CHAIRPERSON:
23
Commissioner Cadd?
24
MS. CADD:
25
Hi.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Welcome.
And I have no
questions at this time but I am excited about hearing
122
1
about this alternative energy.
2
MR. KOETTING:
3
MS. CADD:
Thank you.
I heard Tesla so was doing
4
something now with batteries to try to make them go up
5
to a thousand years.
MR.
6
KOETTING:
Yeah,
it's -- you know,
if he
7
knew, being part of batteries my entire life, again,
I
8
can't say how excited I am for an opportunity to start
9
generating revenue off of an opportunity,
it's always
10
my career,
11
grants and things and funding.
12
time that I am actually going to see an opportunity to
13
generate cash, positive cash flow and make revenue for
14
the technology.
15
super bowl.
16
super bowl.
17
18
22 years has basically been paid for by
And this is the first
That's -- you know,
I call this our
We have a great team and I call this our
MS. CADD:
That's wonderful.
I'm looking
forward to it.
19
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
20
Mayor Waterman, please.
21
MAYOR WATERMAN:
I am happy to see this kind
22
of technology and -- brought to the City of Pontiac.
23
This establishes us as a city that has -- attracts
24
innovative industrial manufacturing uses.
25
occasion early on,
And I had an
just after you first closed the deal
123
1
with IRG to Mr. Soles,
I believe, was the one who
2
brought the whole team of your people here --
3
MR. KOETTING:
Yes.
4
MAYOR WATERMAN:
to meetings and we talked
5
about the prospect for having the company come to town.
6
Now,
7
little bit,
8
other plant in Troy,
9
consolidate with this site as well; is that true?
you might want to talk about your timeframe a
I think,
for our edification and also the
I think you heard you're going to
MR. KOETTING:
10
Yes, Madam Mayor.
Now,
it
11
would be right now, we contain two buildings or we
12
reside in two buildings, a total of about 28,000 square
13
feet.
14
lease right now and people will be looking at moving
15
those operations to Pontiac.
Those will be -- you know, we're actually under
Right now, we have a small pilot line, which
16
17
I think Mr. Sabo saw.
18
other board members got a chance to see it.
19
doing that to validate our process and our -- and our
20
modules.
21
be moving to Pontiac.
22
is why I don't sleep well at night because my boss has
23
me on this one.
24
everything goes forward,
25
And I don't know if any of the
We're
We don't sell anything yet but that will all
The timeframe is,
you know,
this
We will be starting to move, provided
we'll begin moving in June.
We look to have the building -- or from
124
1
our-- our facility in Troy being stopped, I'll
2
probably be looking for a job if I don't have us out of
3
there by the end of the year.
4
of there somewhere around August or September.
But ideally, we're out
5
Production will -- is slated right now to be
6
starting in the third quarter of next year of which we
7
will be making about 500,000 units a year of energy
8
storage units.
MAYOR WATERMAN:
9
10
So it's really exciting.
significant.
That's
So --
MR. KOETTING:
11
500,000.
It is.
And we have -- you
12
know, not to bore you guys but we have this franchising
13
thing that we look at with this factory and the
14
recycling and everything when you look at large energy
15
farms,
16
the level of purities, all the things that we're
17
engineering into it are to be sold as a model and,
18
potentially, they are self-funding energy farms,
19
meaning batteries do die.
20
right modular unit, it's -- it's self-funding, funding
21
itself in a way because the material is battery --
22
there is
23
actually not percentage-wise here in Michigan but is
24
value is the highest recycling commodity there, so it's
25
a 99.9 percent.
this is a model factory.
So the cleanliness,
That, if you create the
there are -- the only thing recycles --
125
THE CHAIRPERSON:
1
2
Could I ask you,
could you
come just a little closer to the microphone, please.
MR. KOETTING:
3
Sure.
About 99 percent of the
So it's
4
materials are recycled back into the battery.
5
a real neat opportunity to close the ecosystem for
6
energy storage.
MAYOR WATERMAN:
7
8
about your enthusiasm.
just get geeked.
You talk
It is just revving me up here.
MR. KOETTING:
9
I
You should come to our
10
facility.
11
always had good funding but we've done a real good job
12
of making our money go a long way.
13
I
get real involved with this stuff.
To the best of our knowledge,
We've
our venture
14
capitalist, we are the only organization that's been on
15
time, met or exceeded deliverables and we've been
16
30 percent under budget and established three --
17
(Clapping.)
18
MR. KOETTING:
Thank you.
We've established
19
three completely novel patents in a technology that is
20
150 years old.
21
22
MAYOR WATERMAN:
Well,
there's certain bullet
points we want to capture here.
23
MR. JOHNSON:
24
MAYOR WATERMAN:
25
MR. JOHNSON:
Absolutely.
And that's great.
It is.
126
MAYOR WATERMAN:
1
The other question,
I know
2
as we talked earlier we connected you with people on
3
our side, our team who can help move the project along.
4
But one of the things we didn't mention, and I think
5
it's important,
6
the type of jobs that would be available.
7
transferred on but the ones that will be new offered,
8
just want to put out the word,
MR. KOETTING:
9
10
is our workforce development and also
again,
Some will be
I
to your HR staff.
We've already actually made
contact.
11
MAYOR WATERMAN:
12
MR. KOETTING:
13
MAYOR WATERMAN:
14
MR. KOETTING:
You've made contact?
With our facility -Right.
we're also actually using
15
some of the facilities that we have right now to be
16
training our supervisors.
17
they have good skills and we actually want to provide
18
supervisory skills and we want to use that funding
19
there,
20
A lot of them are trained,
if it's available.
And also,
like you said, from a placement,
21
we're looking to put people into this facility who are
22
from the area.
23
kid,
24
technology center.
25
built.
You know,
this is,
growing up, Truck and Bus,
You know,
like I said,
you know, GM,
I was a
it's a
I remember when the Silverdome was
it's a great opportunity.
127
MAYOR WATERMAN:
1
Well,
I wanted to give you
2
enough time to get, you know, established, get your
3
site plan and that kind of thing but just put out the
4
word again that this may be a timely time for me to
5
make that connection with our job link and find out the
6
kinds of positions that you'll be looking for so that
7
we can make that connection within our citizenry that
8
can be either trained or utilized on this facility
9
because this is a great opportunity for our workforce
10
as well.
11
MR. KOETTING:
Absolutely.
12
MAYOR WATERMAN:
13
THE CHAIRPERSON:
14
Mrs.
15
MS. PARLOVE:
All right.
Thank you, Mayor.
Parlove.
Good evening, gentlemen.
And
16
wow,
17
to end the evening on but so thrilling to hear.
18
have an idea of how many people will be employed at the
19
site?
20
this is pretty amazing, not what I was expecting
MR. KOETTING:
Do you
So by the end of the year, we
21
will have about 160 or 180 in that facility.
22
depends on how many people we bring forward early for
23
starting production operation and things.
24
September, I would expect 110 or 112 people.
25
MS. PARLOVE:
A lot
In
And how many of those are
128
1
already in Troy?
MR. KOETTING:
2
Seventy-five of them were
3
already in Troy -- actually, more than that.
4
we're combining Exalt and EPVS and somebody at Exalt
5
Engineering.
6
Exalt and that's closing down and they're moving
7
operations to Pontiac so there's about ten or twelve
8
there so it's around a hundred people.
MS.
9
Because
There's a lease-out facility owned by
PARLOVE:
Okay.
And then when the
10
batteries are manufactured and then put into use, where
11
are they going to be used?
MR.
12
KOETTING:
So again,
our first --
13
depending how savvy they are and what the energy field
14
is -- I don't mean that to sound contradictory.
15
one of our first grid systems is what they call a
16
''descriptive grid''.
17
there's very expensive energy for push or frequency
18
regulation, what people are doing is distributing
19
smaller blocks of power throughout cities and
20
throughout organizations to be able to use, you know,
21
the buy low at night, sell high and then you can do
22
frequency push during the day,
23
expensive.
24
25
In short,
But
So if you look at place where
which is very, very
if I have a load for something in
order for a firm or me or whoever it is to start that
1
spinning load and try to compensate, it's very, very
2
expensive.
3
units of energy,
4
which are kind of difficult to get people to buy into,
5
they're smaller units that are distributed.
6
J
MS. PARLOVE:
Okay.
rather than in your phone
MR. KOETTING:
10
MS. PARLOVE:
11
MR. KOETTING:
But
so my -- most of myself
13
Volt system, so we've gone through some very, very
14
difficult evaluations.
15
about a five-year period.
16
going to see is what they call a "macro hybrid" we have
17
these stop-starts now but that will be moving forward
18
in about three years.
I
I
So getting into a car, it's
So that would be what you're
Good.
I
I
And when you were a kid,
I
did you put your tongue on the nine-volt battery?
MR. KOETTING:
I did.
I
I spent a better part
22
of two years in Argonia, putting in a plant that made D
23
cells and we actually powered bicycles off them at
24
almost 25 miles an hour.
25
I
I
-- or a car?
and my team were responsible for developing the Chevy
21
I
Yeah, absolutely.
12
MS. PARLOVE:
I
So it's -- actually,
8
20
I
instead of big cargos of batteries,
it's more in -- it's used more in, like, a business
19
I
So they're doing that with this smaller
7
9
I
I
I
I
I said when I was a kid, if I found out I
I
I
130
1
could power my bike off of D cells it would have been
2
all over.
MS. PARLOVE:
3
4
our City.
5
you best of luck.
thank you for considering
We're thrilled to have you here.
MR. KOETTING:
6
7
Well,
Thank you very much.
We wish
We're
excited to be here.
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
Commissioner Payne, please.
10
MS.
Thank you.
Welcome and thank you so very
PAYNE:
11
much for your interest in Pontiac.
12
just really just been blowing my mind.
13
any questions because
14
this -- since he was ten years old, you know,
15
inventor,
16
things that he's done now and he's still excited about
17
them and you just kind of remind me of his enthusiasm
18
and his excitement so I congratulate you --
inventor.
Your excitement has
I don't have
and I tell you, my son, he's
inventor,
And he has so many different
19
MR. KOETTING:
Thank you.
20
MS. PAYNE:
I'm sure on a lot of hard
21
work,
you know.
22
MR. KOETTING:
23
MS. PAYNE:
24
MR. KOETTING:
25
MS. PAYNE:
We enjoy our work.
Yeah.
Well deserved.
Thank you.
What type of trucking, how many
131
1
will you be transporting, the batteries?
MR. KOETTING:
2
So immediately I think we have
3
scheduled about four to five trucks a day would be
4
coming in and out of the facility.
5
MS.
6
MR. KOETTING:
7
semi.
8
excuse me
Okay.
The product would be done on a
We have three -- two grade levels -- or no,
MR. LITTLE:
9
10
PAYNE:
One grade level and two
recessed.
11
MR. KOETTING:
12
recessed loading docks.
13
MS.
14
was.
15
regard.
PAYNE:
One grade level and two
And I did have what the process
But I think that you have answered that in that
So how does the process go inside and -MR. KOETTING:
16
Yeah.
So I apologize.
And
17
please ask questions and Mr. Jim Sabo was at our
18
facility and I do get excited and I'm a tech rat about
19
things.
20
describe,
But from terms, basic terms,
that I can
we do what we call "converting and assembly."
Converting is when we take materials and we
21
22
make them,
convert them into something we use.
So
23
whether it's a paste or how those types of things are
24
made,
25
call converting when you put things together.
I'm not saying we make paste but that's what you
Then we
132
1
make a product and we modify it and assemble it so we
2
have both types of processes.
•I
In terms of the product that we're making,
3
4
each component or each module has about 200 parts in it
5
and on our web processing, our electrode, we make about
6
seven electrodes a second.
7
MS. PARLOVE:
8
MR. KOETTING:
9
Wow.
So that kind of gives you an
idea of what we're doing.
10
MS. PAYNE:
11
MR. KOETTING:
Yes.
I don't know if that helped or
12
answered but it's a web process.
13
automation, some, you know, fluid processing.
14
MR. BOWDELL:
15
MR. KOETTING:
There's robotics for
Assembling and -- right?
Yes.
Our technology does
16
limit about 20 percent of what's used for conventional
17
batteries and our GEN2 stuff, which we'll start
18
generating profit and revenue.
19
almost a third so it's a paradigm shift in battery
20
manufacturing.
21
MS. PAYNE:
Okay.
Our GEN2 drops that to
Now, did I understand that
22
you said you have an office in Troy and you'll be
23
closing that office and transferring here to this
24
facility?
25
MR. KOETTING:
Yes, ma'am.
134
MR. KOETTING:
1
So there are very clear signs
Right now,
I -- it's
2
for growth in our organization.
3
hard for me not to get excited but I have to have these
4
blinders on,
5
''I'' but we need to get this factory moving.
6
still much ahead but we're moving on.
I need to get.
7
MS.
FEGLEY:
8
MR. KOETTING:
9
THE CHAIRPERSON:
I don't mean to use this
It's
Well, best of luck to you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
And this is an
10
extraordinary, excellent use repopulating and
11
re-purposing some of the our vacant industrial sites as
12
the Mayor pointed out.
13
progress.
14
and high tech and-- and so we're grateful to have this
15
type of industry start to come to Pontiac.
16
you well.
I mean, we are -- we're making
And this is a wonderful blend of industry
17
MR.
18
THE CHAIRPERSON:
19
opportunity.
20
close my
21
KOETTING:
Thank you.
I think this is an exciting
So without further ado,
MR.
JOHNSON:
So we wish
I'm going to
Can I ask for a point of
22
privilege, please,
to speak at this hearing.
23
take two seconds.
Thank you very much for a point of
24
privilege.
25
thoughts in my mind being a property owner on top of or
Chuck Johnson.
It will
There's only a couple
135
1
in close proximity to this development,
it really makes
2
me feel great to know that they're coming and more is
3
coming behind them.
But my question to the developer here or the
4
5
gentlemen here,
the-- the area in which you're going
6
to locate,
7
demolition site that has not moved in any -- any
8
secured direction as it relates to the City of Pontiac
9
and I'm hopeful the Mayor will hear me on this.
we have an existing junkyard and a
I'm just wondering, will this junkyard and/or
10
11
the demolition site have any kind of bearing on your
12
development or any kind of embarrassment for your
13
company,
14
businesses into the area?
15
Is this any kind of embarrassment and -- and to this
16
to this Commission?
17
Thank you very much.
18
knowing that you'll be bringing other
That's all I want to know.
We don't need that junkyard.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
Any -- any
19
further comments or questions from my fellow
20
commissioners, before we -- if you'd like to answer
21
that question,
22
prerogative.
you're welcome to,
23
MR. LITTLE:
24
don't know that we can comment.
25
property you're referencing, but
it's your
We don't own the property so I
I think I know the
136
2
I mean,
THE CHAIRPERSON:
1
you know the site,
you know the area,
you know what you're getting into.
3
MR. LITTLE:
Right.
4
THE CHAIRPERSON:
5
MR. LITTLE:
You're going ahead.
We're very excited about the
6
interest we have and we're very positive and we're
7
excited to be here.
8
THE CHAIRPERSON:
9
MR. TULIKANGAS:
10
thank you.
Things are going to follow
us.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
11
12
Right,
Any questions or comments
from my commissioners before we take a motion, please?
13
MS.
FEGLEY:
I move to approve proposed site
14
plan PT-15-29 Construction Resources One LLC,
15
Power Systems subject to compliance with the following
16
conditions:
17
design standards,
18
South Boulevard curb cut entrance,
19
building construction codes,
20
codes and city permitting requirements,
21
all City of Pontiac Business Licensing requirements.
22
23
Compliance with section 4.403,
Energy
landscaping
approval from City Engineer for new
THE CHAIRPERSON:
compliance with all
energy standards,
fire
compliance with
May we have a second,
please.
24
MS.
PAYNE:
Second.
25
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Any further comments or
137
1
questions before we go to roll call?
2
Mr. Sabo, roll call, please.
3
MR. SABO:
4
MS. FEGLEY:
5
MR. SABO:
6
MS. PAYNE:
7
MR. SABO:
8
MR. NORTHCROSS:
9
MR. SABO:
Commissioner Cadd?
10
MS. CADD:
Yes.
11
MR. SABO:
Mayor Waterman.
12
MAYOR WATERMAN:
13
MR. SABO:
14
MS.
15
MR. SABO:
16
THE CHAIRPERSON:
17
MR. SABO:
18
19
Commissioner Fegley?
Yes.
Commissioner Payne?
Yes.
Commissioner Northcross?
Yes.
Yes.
Commissioner Parlove?
PARLOVE:
Yes.
Chair Thomas.
Yes.
Motion carries unanimously,
congratulations.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Congratulations.
20
to Pontiac.
21
we can't get samples of that but we would like to.
22
Let us know how we can help.
Welcome
MR. KOETTING:
And I guess
Very soon we'll be developing
23
the technology and we'll be pumping back to the grid so
24
we'll be using a portion of energy that we use for
25
manufacturing when we discharge batteries we're going
138
1
to store that and good things to come for the area.
2
THE CHAIRPERSON:
3
MR. KOETTING:
Very good.
I want to make sure and I
4
apologize for Mr. Darr not being able to be here but I
5
want to say how much he appreciates -THE CHAIRPERSON:
6
7
help.
8
MR. KOETTING:
9
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
10
Okay.
11
MR. SABO:
12
THE CHAIRPERSON:
13
Let us all know how we can
Thank you.
That concludes the public hearings.
I have nothing further.
Anyone with any new
business?
14
Any unfinished business?
15
Any other items?
16
MAYOR WATERMAN:
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
MAYOR WATERMAN:
I have one.
Yes, Mayor.
This is an announcement that
19
I trust most,
20
bears the emphasizing.
21
that General Motors made last Friday.
22
announce that they, over the next few years, will be
23
adding $5.4 billion in development in their automotive
24
products, worldwide.
25
announcement anywhere in the world but they chose to
if not all, of you are aware of but it
And that was the announcement
And it was to
And they could have done this
139
1
come and announce it right here in Pontiac, Michigan.
2
And I think that's a significant statement that we were
3
the host of this announcement.
4
5
within Michigan, which is a focus.
6
Michigan cities that they're requesting to focus on for
7
a part of this development investment.
8
those is Pontiac.
9
)
Of course, they talked about the development
And there are three
And one of
So it's $124 million.
So we will expect very proudly to see some of
10
the plans coming forth and, in the time to come, as
11
they prepare that.
12
forward and I just think it bears mentioning.
13
Planning Commission will be in receipt of some of that,
14
those licenses and developments as General Motors.
But this is just another step
So the
15
It just reaffirms the affinity we've had with
16
General Motors over the years and we're just very proud
17
that they chose to recognize the development in Pontiac
18
and bring their announcement forward here.
19
THE CHAIRPERSON:
20
I'm just going to mention briefly that Master
Very good.
Thank you.
21
Plan Advisory Committee, whose job it is to push
22
forward the Master Plan and one of the hot items,
23
priority items on that Master Plan, was attention to
24
vacant land and so we had a vacant land tour.
25
It was -- I think it would be deemed
140
1
successful.
2
had a great
3
of ideas, with regard to re-purposing.
it was a one-day full meeting, exchange
In June we are going to have a vacant land
4
5
fair,
6
re-purposing,
7
but certainly of the Planning Commission and the Master
8
Plan Steering Committee.
9
)
We engaged all the various districts, we
whereby we start try to re-purpose and so
this is high on the agenda of the Mayor
And so by repopulating that vacant land, we
10
will thereby have success with blight eradication or
11
blight removal, or however you wish to refer to it.
12
I think that that can be deemed a success and we'll
13
keep everyone posted.
14
So
Before we go to public comments, Mr. Sabo,
15
one of the Councilpersons this evening mentioned about
16
didn't feel like she was being properly notified of
17
agenda items.
18
that everyone has a full understanding of how that
19
happens and what happens and if there was an oversight
20
on this or what have you.
21
And would you please address that so
MR. SABO:
No, we -- the
all the meetings
22
are publicly noticed and the clerk is provided a copy
23
of all the Planning Commission agendas; that's how we
24
make the notification.
25
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Right.
And I was aware of
141
But I wanted you to be on record with that.
1
that.
2
without further ado,
MR.
3
again.
So
any public comments?
JOHNSON:
Of course.
Chuck Johnson,
Thank you very
4
much,
455 South Boulevard East.
5
You know,
6
almost 54 years in this town.
And I'm a businessman
7
here and I own property here.
And to see developments
8
like this come into this City,
it fascinates me and I
9
know the does the same for you commissioners.
I've got a lot of stake in this city,
50 --
10
But you know what really hurts is whenever
11
and this is to the staff and the Mayor specifically,
12
when we have to live with the blight in the areas that
13
we have on our main streets and roads in this city.
14
It's an embarrassment to me to have to endure, on an
15
everyday basis,
16
city and can't figure out why the City of Pontiac can't
17
do anything about the slum and the blight.
Mayor,
18
to watch as these people drive into our
you've spoke about it numerous times
19
in your comments on Council but I can't understand why
20
that blighted condition on South Boulevard is still
21
existing and nothing is being done about it.
22
comment.
That's my
Thank you very much.
23
THE CHAIRPERSON:
24
MS. HASSON:
25
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Thank you.
Hi, good evening,
yes,
I also.
Will you please state your
142
1
name and address?
MS. HASSON:
2
3
Oh, Linda Hasson,
3015 Anderson
Circle.
4
THE CHAIRPERSON:
5
MS. HASSON:
Thank you,
Ms.
Hasson.
Also I saw you on TV and I went
6
to the website and I saw no agenda, no package, nothing
7
for today's date.
8
the Mayor in regards to getting the Clerk's Office kind
9
of more like when you go to Detroit, they have every
So I wanted to eventually talk with
10
day what the meetings are going to be and you can pick
11
up the paper, the agendas,
12
you know, because,
13
wants me out here every day,
14
kind of like to be able to have some access.
15
you know, so that this way
let's face it,
I don't think anybody
looking,
you know.
So I'd
As long as everything is going okay with
16
Rizzo and you made sure that the property that they
17
have already, you know,
18
followed,
19
redone to pass more, plus the fact about the recycling
20
for free.
21
what it's like out there.
22
have a,
23
there because of making decision for the future of the
24
City.
25
ascertained, everything's
I was impressed at the fact that they had
I have not utilized it yet so I'm not sure
you know,
But I'm hoping that you all
vested take into what's going on out
And also I'd like to iterate that I've had
143
1
issues with blight in the City of Pontiac and there's a
2
process and it's a really good process but you do have
3
to call in every so often to -- I think it's Wade and
4
Trim who does the complaints.
5
with complaints.
6
deal with the issues.
7
they -- you call them up a few days later,
8
them,
9
property may not have a license, it may not,
10
I take pictures and they go and they
they'll go look,
be up to,
You fill out a paper
And if you don't feel that
refresh
they'll even find out the
you know,
you know, whatever.
So -- but I think that this, blight website
11
12
that the Mayor's working on in the City,
13
is going to be instrumental.
14
a bunch of people bought $500 properties at the Oakland
15
County -- perhaps if there would have been this site
16
where they could have went to,
17
there that it was on the demolition list.
18
have five or six lists.
Because,
I think this
if you remember,
it would have said on
I myself
So people didn't know what's going on,
19
20
what's -- and I think that this will be nothing but an
21
asset to have,
22
everything about this property.
23
find out about property,
24
buying.
25
sounds like to me,
this area that you can go and find out
Businesspeople can
you know, anybody who's
It's very simple.
It will be simple,
it
compared to what channels I've gone
144
1
through to look at things.
2
So I'm actually very excited and I think this
3
is a great investment for the future of the City of
4
Pontiac and I'd like to thank you all for your service.
5
Thank you.
THE CHAIRPERSON:
6
7
Linda.
Thank
you.
8
9
Thank you,
Just one comment before we close.
Gordon, do
you ultimately put that together?
10
MR. BOWDELL:
11
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Yes.
You do?
Would it be
12
possible,
13
it as attachment to the City Council,
14
like, hey,
15
you know,
to -- to take this document and do
just so they feel
there it is, an e-mail.
MR. SABO:
We provide the
the clerk is the
16
party that deals with the Council.
We provide all that
17
information to the Clerk.
I'm not sure how
18
come this wasn't on but we send that to the IT
19
department every month and,
20
people,
We also,
you know, people are
they may not have put it on.
21
THE CHAIRPERSON:
22
MR.
NORTHCROSS:
Oh, okay.
One item.
I'd like to
23
request that my package be sent to me electronically,
24
if possible.
25
MR. SABO:
Yeah, we'll look into that.
145
MR. NORTHCROSS:
1
Yeah,
I had a real issue
2
that I actually had to come to the department and pick
3
up my package today, because I had not received it.
4
And I think, you know,
5
to make that another -- that next leap of just going
6
entirely electronically -- I guess PDF still works
7
well -- and just bypass that whole thing of the mail.
8
I think it would be faster and probably even
9
cost-saving.
10
11
like that we -- that we may need
THE CHAIRPERSON:
Any further comments
or questions?
May I have a move or a
12
13
motion to adjourn?
14
motion for adjournment?
15
MS.
16
MS. PAYNE:
17
THE CHAIRPERSON:
18
Okay.
All in favor
PARLOVE:
yeah.
I have a
yeah.
May I have a
I'm motioning.
It's adjourned.
I'm moving.
Seconded.
All in favor,
say "ayen.
19
THE COMMISSIONERS:
20
THE CHAIRPERSON:
21
(Meeting was concluded at 9:25p.m.)
22
23
24
25
*
*
Aye.
Thank you.
*
*
146
'I
C E R T I F I C A T E
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I, Mona Storm, do hereby certify that I have
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recorded stenographically the proceedings had and
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testimony taken in the meeting, at the time and place
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hereinbefore set forth, and I do further certify that
7
the foregoing transcript, consisting of (146) pages, is
8
a true and correct transcript of my said stenographic
9
notes.
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Date
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Mona Storm
CSR-4460